Re: The Steve Bruce thread

by deadbuzzardalive Tue Aug 21, 2018 4:00 pm

Bruce isn't going to get the sack at the moment, with us being unbeaten, and having taken seven points out of a possible nine, and two of those games being away from home... But with him a bad run is never far away, so we'll have to see how our new owners react then... The trouble is, he always seems to do just about enough to keep his job, but not enough to keep us as serious contenders for top two... We don't really know what Sawiris and Edens are all about, having not heard anything from them since they bought shares in the club, apparently they're meant to be appointing a CEO within in the next few weeks, so I guess the identity of that person will give us an indication, and might also tell us something about Bruce's long term future.

by deadbuzzardalive Wed Aug 22, 2018 10:42 pm

He isn't going anywhere for the time being, unbeaten, averaging two points a game, albeit we've been somewhat lucky, and the owners will want to give him a run of games with the new signings... But I really hope they're ruthless, should we seriously look like faltering, we need to be seriously challenging to be top of the league, not finding ourselves constantly six or more points adrift of top two as we were last season, happy to scrape into the play-offs, it's that kind of unambitious thinking that cost us promotion in the end.

by big ming Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:27 am

Despite an improved overall performance and putting aside the defensive shambles, I remain firmly of the view that we would be doing better with a more astute manager/coach. It was noticeable that Dean Smith changed tactics at half time and momentum swung to Brentford as a result. Bruce responded later but, in the end we needed a last second "get out of jail" effort which turned what looked like certain defeat into an unlikely draw.
Other teams (Leeds the obvious example) are pinging it about with more speed and accuracy. In my view, you can play Whelan or Jedinak but not both. Perhaps they could alternate as defensive mid in matches where one is required (Jedinak against the teams that are tall and physical). If we get Abraham we will be blistering in attack with the new wingers but full back and centreback could easily cost us if those positions remain unaddressed.

by FoxyAV Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:49 am

We could afford to let in some goals if we scored more but we don't seem to be cutting enough in attack. Two seasons ago Kodjia scored most of our goals, last season almost all of them came from midfield, I'm not sure Bruce can combine the two. It all seems so odd though that he is playing Jedi when he so obviously looks lost and Tunazebe when he'd be significantly better than Jedi and De Laet would be significantly better at RB. From what I could see of him last night it reminded me of Lescott. Chester ends up covering Jedi, which compromises everything.

by Terry Derry Fri Aug 24, 2018 4:57 am

deadbuzzardalive wrote:He isn't going anywhere for the time being, unbeaten, averaging two points a game, albeit we've been somewhat lucky, and the owners will want to give him a run of games with the new signings... But I really hope they're ruthless, should we seriously look like faltering, we need to be seriously challenging to be top of the league, not finding ourselves constantly six or more points adrift of top two as we were last season, happy to scrape into the play-offs, it's that kind of unambitious thinking that cost us promotion in the end.

Very true. We need to be playing well most of the time,not scraping results out.

by FoxyAV Fri Aug 24, 2018 9:19 am

My thinking is the owners have to decide if they're serious about promotion. If yes, we need a new manager. If no, Steve Bruce is an acceptable - if not particularly exciting - Championship manager.

by achilles Fri Aug 24, 2018 9:57 am

Apparently we need an average of 2 points a game to gain automatic promotion so as long as that continues his job is safe.

by FoxyAV Fri Aug 24, 2018 10:02 am

achilles wrote:Apparently we need an average of 2 points a game to gain automatic promotion so as long as that continues his job is safe.

Win at home, draw away.

by Dazzle Sat Aug 25, 2018 5:01 pm

Just not fucking good enough. Ipswich, Brentford, and Reading in one week and 3 fucking points. Everyone else has pissed on Ipswich and Reading. That has to be strike 2 against Bruce, he’s got no more chances after today.

by deadbuzzardalive Sat Aug 25, 2018 6:26 pm

Until he's gone we're just wasting our time.

by achilles Sat Aug 25, 2018 7:40 pm

deadbuzzardalive wrote:Until he's gone we're just wasting our time.

Unfortunately I have to agree, we can't carry on like this but who it is I have no idea!

by STO67 Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:50 pm

The club is treading water with Bruce. Yes, being 4th and unbeaten looks ok, but only 2 wins from our first 5 games with 3 of them being at home is poor, particularly when you consider the the opposition contain two of the bottom three clubs in the division. Players playing out of position shows me a lack of planning from Bruce and a lack of prioritising his transfer targets. We desperately need a proper centre back and left back. I am a little surprised by Bruce in this regard, given how defensive he is as a Manager, you would think he'd start at the back and work his way forward. Owners, take note as you will be charged with replacing him soon.

by VillaBill Sun Aug 26, 2018 12:37 pm

I welcome Bolasie of course, but we have Albert, El Ghazi &!Elmo who all play wide right, perhaps Bolasie is going to stop live our LB issue ?

by big ming Sun Aug 26, 2018 3:26 pm

Does anyone know if there is a loan market for Managers/Coaches?

by FoxyAV Sun Aug 26, 2018 5:09 pm

VillaBill wrote:I welcome Bolasie of course, but we have Albert, El Ghazi &!Elmo who all play wide right, perhaps Bolasie is going to stop live our LB issue ?

Elmo's one of Bruce's best mates, he's scored twice from right wing, who is buying in these wingers?

Scott Hogan cost us £12million and Bruce has single-handedly made him worth far less. Sacking Bruce would cost £3million apparently, surely far less than we'd lose on Hogan, and if we had even a basically competent manager in who could look at the compilation of Hogan's goals at Brentford a couple of seasons ago and see how he plays, have a quick look at the players we have and tell them to go and work out how they want to play we'd have a proper striker on our hands. One who isn't selfish with the ball. I bet Grealish and McGinn would love playing with Hogan up front.

It's all a matter of maths in the end. If we have an expensive squad to run and the rewards are so high there's no way on earth the new owners will let us slip behind. Two wins, three draws (of which two were at home) with the squad we have, and Bruce weakening it on purpose and playing his old boys wherever he can slot them in?

by andrew24561 Mon Aug 27, 2018 3:27 pm

big ming wrote:Does anyone know if there is a loan market for Managers/Coaches?

I've come to the conclussion It really dosent matter who we have in charge, IMHO there are certain fans who will criticise and find fault in everything they do

by FoxyAV Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:27 pm

andrew24561 wrote:
big ming wrote:Does anyone know if there is a loan market for Managers/Coaches?

I've come to the conclussion It really dosent matter who we have in charge, IMHO there are certain fans who will criticise and find fault in everything they do

How do you think Bruce is doing? Third time lucky or do you think he has a plan for promotion?

by achilles Mon Aug 27, 2018 8:17 pm

andrew24561 wrote:
big ming wrote:Does anyone know if there is a loan market for Managers/Coaches?

I've come to the conclussion It really dosent matter who we have in charge, IMHO there are certain fans who will criticise and find fault in everything they do

Isn't that called LIFE? The Steve Bruce thread - Page 29 4025243045

by andrew24561 Mon Aug 27, 2018 9:32 pm

FoxyAV wrote:
andrew24561 wrote:
big ming wrote:Does anyone know if there is a loan market for Managers/Coaches?

I've come to the conclussion It really dosent matter who we have in charge, IMHO there are certain fans who will criticise and find fault in everything they do

How do you think Bruce is doing? Third time lucky or do you think he has a plan for promotion?

I think he's falling well short of expectations, playing outdated boring football, I'm sure he has a plan for promotion but its not clear to see. As you can see I'm no fan of his but I fail to see the good in criticising his every involvement in team affairs, as I've posted in the past while he's in charge of the team I will support them, Bruce included for the good of the club.
I appreciate this is a fans forum and I respect every posters opinion as I would expect others to respect mine, my original post was not aimed at any particular individual just the regularity in which similar posts are aired.
Rant over

by Dazzle Tue Aug 28, 2018 10:18 am

I wonder who the owners might be looking at as possible replacements for Bruce? Most transfer activity seems to involve Mendes at the moment, I wonder if he might throw a manger/coach into the owners laps? I can’t really think of anything outstanding domestically that I am drawn to, obviously people will be drawn to Dean Smith but I think the owners will want to go bigger name than that.
I remain convinced that if we’re more than 4pts off the top after 10 games then Bruce is on very shaky ground and the owners will pull the trigger, there’s no doubt in my mind that these guys will have been looking at alternatives probably since they walked in and with Mendes instrumental they shouldn’t be short of names. Bruce requires a major win run now to keep his job I would think.

by Dions_Bald_Head Tue Aug 28, 2018 11:32 am

Good point about point difference @dazzle - I was fearing that only a big slump would make them spring into action but it may be something like a point difference threshold.

Reading the regular football stats section in the Times this weekend (which was has us as most likely to gain automatic promotion) saying that it's always a tougher to call in the Championship, not because of quality but because the season is so short for the number of teams. As we know, a sudden slump or surge can see a dramatic change in league position & if it's a downwards march it's harder to halt a losing mentality when you're hurtling towards the bottom (assuming you haven't just lost some key players to temporary injuries). In short, despite the (admittedly entertaining) ups & downs of the Championship, if a team is extremely serious about promotion they can't afford to get into a losing streak because you have to pull out of it quicker than you would in the PL.

So don't lose too many games in succession. Sounds obvious but it highlights that if we're talking about promotion in one season rather than more, the owners can't afford to be patient with the management.

by deadbuzzardalive Tue Aug 28, 2018 11:40 am

I don't think Mendes is that instrumental in the goings on at the club at the moment, as it stands we only have two of his players, I'm sure there are other agencies that have more than one player at Villa as well, I know Bjarnason and Nyland have the same agent... That said the idea of Mendes finding us a replacement for Bruce did cross my mind, but looking on his list of clients, there isn't really anyone that stands out... A long shot, but If Wolves remain winless for much longer and they panic and fire Nuno, maybe he's someone we could go for, all depends on timing I guess.

I think we need to appoint a CEO first, and maybe a DOF, at the moment there's not really anyone at the club to make the footballing decisions, outside of Bruce picking players... Once we get some people in to run the club on a day to day basis, and implement a plan, that's when we're more likely to see Bruce come under pressure.

Hopefully we see some appointments before we return from the international break; in the summer we lost doctors, scouts, a CEO, a DOF, and others, so there are a lot of people that need replacing... It's all very quiet though.

by FoxyAV Tue Aug 28, 2018 11:45 am

We also have a glaring issue at the moment which is we only have one striker good at hoofball (Davis) but he's injured. Kodjia is still a bit of a liability (now we have better wingers will he stay in the middle a bit more so we have some threat there?) but is doing an ok job. As far as I can tell Audrey and Hogan are irrelevant because they are left chasing ghosts and running down the goalie. A new manager with progressive views on formations and tactics would probably be able to work with the strikers we have rather than trying to spend more money bringing in someone new to compensate for a very specific flaw of Bruce's. Hell, could we even see McCormack back? Probably not but who knows.

by big ming Tue Aug 28, 2018 1:35 pm

Dions_Bald_Head wrote:Good point about point difference @dazzle - I was fearing that only a big slump would make them spring into action but it may be something like a point difference threshold.

Reading the regular football stats section in the Times this weekend (which was has us as most likely to gain automatic promotion) saying that it's always a tougher to call in the Championship, not because of quality but because the season is so short for the number of teams. As we know, a sudden slump or surge can see a dramatic change in league position & if it's a downwards march it's harder to halt a losing mentality when you're hurtling towards the bottom (assuming you haven't just lost some key players to temporary injuries). In short, despite the (admittedly entertaining) ups & downs of the Championship, if a team is extremely serious about promotion they can't afford to get into a losing streak because you have to pull out of it quicker than you would in the PL.

So don't lose too many games in succession. Sounds obvious but it highlights that if we're talking about promotion in one season rather than more, the owners can't afford to be patient with the management.

Yes.... and don't draw too many (especially at home). Draws will kill you nearly as badly as defeats in terms of the league table.

by deadbuzzardalive Tue Aug 28, 2018 2:59 pm

We've drawn the last three games, and it's not beyond the bounds of possibility that we may well fail to win any of the next three, which are all away from home, that would leave us six games without a win, even if you ignore the Burton game, we've still got to beat one of Sheffield United, or Blackburn away, to avoid going five games without a win in the league.

If we fail to beat Sheffield United, then I think we should use the international break to bring in a replacement.

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