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Tim Sherwood: Villa reject

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Does Tim Sherwood still have your support?

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Post by Army villain Thu Oct 22, 2015 3:45 pm

It's all well and good people backing Tim, problem is the future of Aston villa is at stake.
It looks like the players have no fath in him.no wonder with the tactics? And the comments on how to play football,
Lost the support of the fans,
Lost the team, and the dressing room,
Mr Fox needs to get in the chicken pen and sort this lot out.
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Post by EbeneezerGoode Thu Oct 22, 2015 3:55 pm

DaveAV1 wrote:Now Jermain Jenas is backing Sherwood. I have never known so much media support for any manager of any club, when the clear evidence is that the man is totally useless. And by complete contrast I've never known a fanbase so consistent in their condemnation of a manager.

This evidence, backed up by the report above, suggests that Sherwood is truely a Machiavellian character who cynically exploits contacts within the footballing media and indeed the wider football world. His entire focus is on Tim Sherwood and holds this football club, us it's fans and anyone else he falls under his spell in utter contempt. He is not an incompetent chancer, he is a very dangerous and manipulative man.

I am not at all surprised that he manages to dupe our simple minded absent owner. However I believed that Tom Fox, whilst possibly lacking football know how, would be sharp enough to know when he's being taken for a mug. Sadly up until now that doesn't seem to be the case, and unless he wakes up, he must join the Hall of Shame responsible for overseeing the downfall of one of the most historic and successful teams in England.

Fox is not a billionaire who doesn't need to work. Surely if only for the sake of self interest, he must see that his own career will not get off lightly if he is at the helm of what is rapidly becoming a footballing Titanic.

Superb post.

I think others have not been duped so easily. Both QPR and West Brom decided against appointing him for the reasons that have become obvious. When he gets the bullet and replaced by someone competent who will give club and players an immediate lift at what point do all those journalists and ex-players admit defeat or start looking like mugs? In my opinion he is one of the poorest managers ever to grace the premier league.
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Post by achilles Thu Oct 22, 2015 5:20 pm

The club is becoming a bit like a circus now, everybody has an opinion except the people that really matter! Popcorn
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Post by DaveAV1 Thu Oct 22, 2015 5:45 pm

I agree EG at some point Tim's media muppets will realise the writing is on the wall and rapidly desert The Good Ship Timbo. They'll then declare that they always knew he wasn't the right man. Especially if his successor starts well.
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Post by DaveAV1 Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:25 pm

Jenas is at it again in our very own loyal and knowledgeable Evening Mail. Declaring that we will be relegate with or without the brilliant Mr Sherwood. He blames the board for not strengthening the squad in the summer, nothing to do with Timtastic that one then. He then blames the club for being arrogant enough to not believe we would be in a relegation fight this season. Timmy "we'll never be in a relegation battle again" Sherwood couldn't possibly have anything to do with that either.

Another average footballer from the Harry Rednap school of media manipulation, sticking up for his old school buddy. That coupled with the general hatred of all things from the Midlands and we have an almost runaway train of anti Villa bile coming from the media.

If Fox stands by and lets this happen he should be slaughtered with Lerner and Sherwood. Where are the big hitters with Villa in their blood in the club's hour of need? And no not you Mr Collymore, I said big hitters not big gobs.
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Post by Guest Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:25 pm

Wouldn't it be beautiful if Timmy turned it around, made us play good football and go on a winning spree? My god I'd love that. Not sure there is enough pie in the midlands.
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Post by DaveAV1 Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:34 pm

You bring the cutlery and I'll eat the pie mate. But we both know it ain't gonna happen Sad.
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Post by VillaBill Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:36 pm

We were all generally pleased how last season finished, the transfer window was as exciting as anyone can remember, Sherwood had us playing 100% better than the Lambert days, but this season has been far worse than any of us could of feared.

We can all be wise after the fact, but I think the general consensus was positive towards Sherwood.

Sherwood had earned his chance at a full season, but it looks pretty clear we are certain for relegation, I just cant see an alternative at the moment, I am at a loss.

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Post by Terry Derry Thu Oct 22, 2015 7:50 pm

VillaBill wrote:We were all generally pleased how last season finished, the transfer window was as exciting as anyone can remember, Sherwood had us playing 100% better than the Lambert days, but this season has been far worse than any of us could of feared.

We can all be wise after the fact, but I think the general consensus was positive towards Sherwood.

Sherwood had earned his chance at a full season, but it looks pretty clear we are certain for relegation, I just cant see an alternative at the moment, I am at a loss.


I think the cup final performance and that at Southampton rang a few alarm bells.
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Post by Guest Thu Oct 22, 2015 8:11 pm

I agree Terry. And that's the number one reason I've decided Rodgers would be a mistake. When you spend £ 200-300 million and let Stoke beat you 6-1. I can't even imagine how bad our defence and discipline would be with him.
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Post by Terry Derry Thu Oct 22, 2015 8:28 pm

It's a vicious circle anyway. Until LernEr goes, we will never be any good, whoever the manager is.
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Post by Dazzle Thu Oct 22, 2015 9:04 pm

DaveAV1 wrote:Jenas is at it again in our very own loyal and knowledgeable Evening Mail. Declaring that we will be relegate with or without the brilliant Mr Sherwood. He blames the board for not strengthening the squad in the summer, nothing to do with Timtastic that one then. He then blames the club for being arrogant enough to not believe we would be in a relegation fight this season. Timmy "we'll never be in a relegation battle again" Sherwood couldn't possibly have anything to do with that either.

Another average footballer from the Harry Rednap school of media manipulation, sticking up for his old school buddy. That coupled with the general hatred of all things from the Midlands and we have an almost runaway train of anti Villa bile coming from the media.

If Fox stands by and lets this happen he should be slaughtered with Lerner and Sherwood. Where are the big hitters with Villa in their blood in the club's hour of need? And no not you Mr Collymore, I said big hitters not big gobs.

Jenas is wrong when he says we are doomed with or without Sherwood, but he is bang on the money when he talks of the net spend during the summer. We lost our two standout players during the summer and haven't replaced Benteke at all. There should have been another £20-25m available on top of what we bought
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Post by De Kuip Thu Oct 22, 2015 9:28 pm

From the Guardian today:

Tim Sherwood staying positive on his future but Aston Villa stay quiet

On the previous occasion Aston Villa lost five successive Premier League matches, Tom Fox decided Paul Lambert needed to be sacked. Randy Lerner asked the chief executive to talk through his thought process and, satisfied with the answers he received, backed the man he trusts to run the club to relieve Lambert of his duties. Tim Sherwood was spared that fate after Villa were beaten at Chelsea but the suspicion lingers that another of those transatlantic phone calls may not be too far away.

Villa host a struggling Swansea side on Saturday and Sherwood, with one point from a possible 21, can ill afford a sixth defeat on the spin. After a fortnight of speculation, the supporters’ trust has called on the club to end the silence and back or sack the manager. Villa are saying nothing but privately insist that at no stage has Sherwood been given an ultimatum to win a match within a certain time frame, reasoning it would not be the greatest motivational tactic to go down that path.
At the same time, there is no escaping the fact the Villa board are deeply concerned at the club’s position on the back of a dismal run of results and, with that in mind, it would be a major surprise if they put out a statement in support of Sherwood. With Villa four points adrift of 17th position and without a victory since Rudy Gestede scored at Bournemouth on the opening day, the manager’s position is perilous and there is no point pretending otherwise.

It has not gone unnoticed within the club that Villa not only have a tricky run of matches ahead to negotiate but that in the corresponding games last season (Watford were in the Championship, and so their visit in November is excluded) they lost six of the next seven fixtures. Villa had also accumulated another seven points from the games played so far.

While the past is never a reliable barometer for the future, in a broader sense Villa supporters could be forgiven for arguing otherwise after what they have been through. Villa have flirted with relegation every season since 2010 and a table based on the 12 clubs that have competed in the past six Premier League campaigns shows the Midlands club bottom with more defeats and fewer goals than anyone else. The malaise, in other words, is deep-rooted and the worry is that Villa, despite their history and size, are starting to feel like a club that belongs in the bottom six.

After promising to arrest the decline if he kept Villa up last season – something that was achieved with a game to spare – Sherwood said on the eve of Saturday’s 2-0 loss at Chelsea that it was agreed in the summer “the objective was to stay in the league” because the board recognised with so many younger players signing and key figures leaving “it was going to be a difficult period for us”.

That recruitment strategy has become a major talking point. Villa reinvested the £40.5m they generated from the sales of Christian Benteke to Liverpool and Fabian Delph to Manchester City and added £10-15m on top to bring in 13 new faces, the majority of whom had never played in the Premier League.

Dismayed at what had gone before, when money was often splurged on high-earning players well past their best and with no sell-on fee, Villa implemented a philosophy this summer that focused predominantly on identifying emerging talent that could be developed and which, in the case of those recruited from overseas, represented better value compared with the English market.

Driving that strategy was Hendrik Almstadt, who joined from Arsenal in July to take up the sporting director role and is big on data analytics, and Paddy Riley, the director of recruitment. Sherwood, 46, has made no secret, whether during his time in charge at Tottenham Hotspur or his early days at Villa, he has little time for the sporting or technical director role and, rightly or wrongly, it is hard to picture him nodding away at everything he is being told by two people who have never played the game at his level.

At his pre-match press conference last week the Villa manager chose his words carefully when asked about transfer strategy and was certainly not critical of the process. He explained how he submitted a list of about 30 names at the start of the summer, that the club came back with some suggestions of their own, and said ultimately “not a player has come in who I didn’t want”. It is, however, an open secret Sherwood would have liked to return to White Hart Lane to do some shopping and was targeting players more familiar with the Premier League.

Either way, the bottom line is the present structure is here to stay at Villa Park and there is a mixture of frustration, bemusement and incredulity within the club that a process designed to bring together expertise and target players to fit a long-term philosophy, rather than the interests of each individual manager at the time, is so often questioned and criticised from outside.

Whatever the rights and wrongs of the signings – and nine games feels far too early to make a judgment on players, especially for those who are trying to adapt to a new league as well as a new country – it is also the case Sherwood has not helped himself at times with his tactics, in particular some of the substitutions, and on other occasions has been let down by individual errors.

Indeed, the number crunchers, inside and outside the club, point to data and key performance indicators from the matches so far that suggest Villa should have much more to show for their efforts than four points, yet everyone – and no one more than Sherwood – knows how football operates and the only statistic that matters when a club is dropping like a stone is the result.

Lambert seemed to have nine lives as he somehow managed to hang on for two-and-a-half dire years that Villa supporters will never get back, but Sherwood is unlikely to be cut the same slack and the potential interest and availability of other managers – David Moyes and Brendan Rodgers in particular – only serves to crank up the pressure on the man who re-energised the club last season.

For those fans calling for a return to the high-tempo, dynamic attacking football that characterised Villa’s resurgence, Sherwood has pointed to the loss of Delph and Tom Cleverley, highlighted how that midfield pair set the tone for the team with their energy and industry, and said “you can only be as swashbuckling as the players will allow you to be”.

It is Benteke’s departure, though, that has hurt the manager and the team the most, and that was always going to be the case with a centre-forward who scored 42 and set up eight of Villa’s 105 Premier League goals during his three years at the club.

Sherwood, to his credit, is putting on a brave face, talking positively,promising to play on the front foot, urging the players to take inspiration from himself and vowing to “keep swinging until it works”. The time has come, however, for one of those haymakers to land.
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Post by Guest Thu Oct 22, 2015 9:46 pm

It would explain why Ilori, Veretout, Ayew amongst others isn't playing a lot. Maybe Sherwood is pissed off about this not being the signings he wanted.
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Post by DaveAV1 Thu Oct 22, 2015 10:22 pm

If we hadn't signed Gestede and used Kozak instead and signed Charlie Austin instead of Ayew (who may come good and I'm not criticising here) then we would have a lot more teeth up front for about the same spend. There may be all kinds of reasons Austin didn't leave QPR for us or anyone else, but leaving those aside, I'm sure we'd be considerably more potent with him in the side.
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Post by Guest Thu Oct 22, 2015 11:13 pm

I'm not sold on Austin at all, but that might just be me. James Beattie'esque player.

I'm not saying I would be against signing him, I'm just not sure jeg would score the goals expected on here.
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Post by achilles Fri Oct 23, 2015 12:11 am

Joppe84 wrote:It would explain why Ilori, Veretout, Ayew amongst others isn't playing a lot. Maybe Sherwood is pissed off about this not being the signings he wanted.

What has happened to him, are we actually ever going to play him?
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Post by Trotters Fri Oct 23, 2015 3:07 am

Rewinding to Fox for a moment, regardless of football, regardless of his future prospects, his job RIGHT NOW will be to focus on broadbased income streams for the club.

Just quite how he'll manage to attract the interest of sponsors is beyond me. I'd not want a business associated with this club even if they let me re-name a stand free of charge so quite why someone would actually pay for the privilege defeats me.

And hopefully that alone (ignoring dwindling crowds) will be enough of an excuse for him to pull the trigger.

We've been in "damage limitation" mode now for a few weeks and no one at the club seems to be doing anything other than watching it all burn.
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Post by DaveAV1 Fri Oct 23, 2015 6:44 am

I agree Trotts. I think the attraction for Fox was that Sherwood is media savy and much easier to sell than Lambert for example. Sherwood makes plenty of boasts about is not being in a relegation battle this year and so that along with his Cheeky Cockney routine is an easy sell for Fox. Particularly because I think Fox's brief is all about commercial development and making us more sellable. Obviously the fundamental issue of being a Premiership club he thought was sorted, because Timmy told him it was. Now he's got a problem that he's not comfortable with.
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Post by DaveAV1 Fri Oct 23, 2015 7:07 am

I'm sorry I can't post the link, but there's an excellent article I found on Newsnow, from The National, which I think is an Arab Emirates publication. It's title is something along the lines of the Swansea game being Sherwood's last stand. It is well written by a journalist who obviously Timmy hasn't got to yet. It's not an anti Sherwood rant, but it is an intelligent report on our season to date.

Hopefully you can perhaps post the link Trotters, it doesn't seem to work on my iPad.
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Post by danclare82 Fri Oct 23, 2015 10:28 am

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Post by Trotters Fri Oct 23, 2015 12:52 pm

Aston Villa tie with Swansea City could be Tim Sherwood’s last stand

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Tim Sherwood and the team look down the pitch to Guzan wondering just what the fuck he's going to do next.


Tim Sherwood shoots from the hip and is willing to die on his sword. He will go down fighting. If it is hard to avoid military metaphors, it is because he introduces them to the conversation and his style of management. Aston Villa seem in a relegation battle. Sherwood is a maverick of a general who may lose his commission.

He is a man under pressure and a mass of contradictions. He is the rookie who had never recruited a player until, in one transfer window at Villa, he brought in 13. He is the supposed apostle of attacking football who, in his last home game, fielded five defenders and claims to be bored by Villa’s football.

He is the outspoken critic who remains unsure of his best team. He has the best win percentage of any Tottenham Hotspur manager in the Premier League, but has won just 11 per cent of his top-flight games with Villa this season. The last eight have produced a solitary point. Even that represented a poor result as it came at home to bottom club Sunderland.

And so Saturday’s match against Swansea City assumes huge proportions for Sherwood. It is his misfortune that enviable alternatives can be eyed. Brendan Rodgers’s CV may be slimmer than his replacement at Liverpool, Jurgen Klopp’s, but it is altogether weightier than Sherwood’s.

David Moyes’s achievements on a limited budget at Everton have long suggested he would be an ideal fit for Villa. Should he leave Real Sociedad then he would be an obvious upgrade.

Moyes has a steely eyed determination that enabled him to drag Everton out of trouble. Sherwood has an emotional volatility, which means that a glance at his face, without even hearing his words, can reveal the scoreline. He has been visibly downcast since the opening-day victory at Bournemouth.

He possesses industrial quantities of self-belief. He has produced bullish rhetoric this week, but it never bodes well when interviews contain more defiance than performances.

Villa’s slide is not entirely Sherwood’s fault; not when he was stripped of the spine of his side by the summer departures of Christian Benteke, Fabian Delph and Ron Vlaar, even if all three are injured now anyway.

Much like Rodgers at Liverpool, he has attempted to deflect responsibility for some of the signings. Pointed references to “the club” in the transfer market are signs that many of the French contingent were not his choices. Sherwood can be a figure of John Bull Englishness, and the indications are that he preferred to shop at home.

Yet Joleon Lescott, who some at West Bromwich Albion were happy to see depart, has disappointed in defence. Villa have contrived to acquire a huge cast of attacking midfielders and wingers but much the brightest, Jack Grealish, is a player they already possessed. Sherwood’s struggles to accommodate others have had the feel of unsuccessful auditions. His substitutions have backfired, especially away at Crystal Palace and Leicester City. A laudable draw and a vital win became two defeats.

Now Villa meet a club who were long their inferiors but have overtaken them. It is 1982 European Cup winners against a club that almost dropped out of the Football League in 2003. It is also a meeting of brothers who arrived from Ligue 1 this summer and who symbolise their respective employers: Jordan Ayew is one of Villa’s expensive disappointments, Andre Ayew one of the signings of the season for Swansea.

In a way, Swansea brought the beginning of the end for Sherwood’s predecessor Paul Lambert. Villa only had 27 per cent of possession when they hosted the Welsh side in December 2013. The Scot had created a team with a lamentable inability to keep the ball. When he then switched to prioritise possession, they had no threat.

Lambert’s Villa lost their identity. Perhaps Sherwood’s Villa have never found one. And so a manager who invariably references armed conflict may be waiting to see if the board pull the trigger.

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Post by Dions_Bald_Head Fri Oct 23, 2015 1:03 pm

That seems like a fairly reasonable assessment of Timothy's time here.
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Post by NARLA24 Fri Oct 23, 2015 1:43 pm

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Post by Trotters Fri Oct 23, 2015 2:55 pm

Just a quick mention...

On a couple of occasions recently, De Kuip has paid it forward like a Sir and really made a difference to people's lives.

I pm'd him to say I'd like to recognise this with an honorary ranking but he wasn't having any la de da business so I've given him the best title I could think of...."Crispy Bacon".


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