Life in the Championship

I have to say I'm feeling incredibly worried about life in the Championship. On the one hand we need to lose all the dead weight holding us back - the usual list of Gabby, N'Zog, Richardson and so on. We keep to keep the players who want to stick with us, and to build the team round them in the future. This is also where the likes of Steer, Gardner, Baker and Robinson (if he does well and we keep him) have their chance to show what they can do in the Championship. The first three I think could make it into our first team next season, Baker's strength and size (and has been mentioned elsewhere, his balls) make him a good partner for Okore.

What worries me most is the general incompetence shown over the last six or so years. In Lerner's desperation to make the club self supporting (hence the tiny net spend compared to the gross spend once all the money from Benteke and Delph was taken into account) it looks like we'll be selling our biggest assets as we go along. Veretout and Ayew are working their asses off at the moment and the shining lights in the team, they're the two players we need to keep most of all but are they working for the club or looking at it (as Benteke did) as the opportunity to showcase their talent before going to a 'bigger' club? At least Amavi looked like he wanted to be here off the pitch as well as on, which is one of the reasons I think we can keep him. Will Lerner though want to sell him and remove his wages from the bill, bearing in mind Cissokho was signed up when we were on a wage economy drive? Will Ayew and Veretout make themselves worth decent enough money that Lerner will sell them?

Another point, we talk about building a team now that will gel and be ready to hit the Championship running next season but if we do involve Baker, Gardner and Steer, they're not going to be gelling with the team until the summer.

It's imperative we use relegation to build a new team for the next five years, one where we don't sell off our best players and where we don't change manager and playing style every 12 months. We need to build on the academy and spend on really hot prospects as well as develop our own. Is our academy being run properly? Does the training go right from the bottom up? It seems that when we have an injury problem we see someone from the first team played out of position rather than an U21 player coming in. I don't know who plays on the right wing in the U21s but if they're using the same formation as the first team, and playing the same way, then when we do have injuries in the first team like with Traore right now, do we have players ready to step up who know what they're doing and can slot right in? I'd say no, and that if we don't get in someone new soon we're going to see Gil, Sinclair or Westwood there, none of whom are right sided attacking wingers.

I just don't feel confident that our board, manager or owner know how to do this. They have shown repeatedly that they don't know how to run a Premier League club and I think they're about to show they don't know how to run a Championship club either. Sure, Fox (no relation) might say the club is doing well and we're bringing in new sponsorship or whatever, but as fans, unless we see a direct correlation to an improvement in how we (enjoy) watching the Villa, we don't give a flying toss. For us it's not about bottom lines (and we put up with having the names of Chinese gambling companies on our shirts only because we're proud to wear the claret and blue), it's about pride and winning matches.

FoxyAV wrote:I have to say I'm feeling incredibly worried about life in the Championship. On the one hand we need to lose all the dead weight holding us back - the usual list of Gabby, N'Zog, Richardson and so on. We keep to keep the players who want to stick with us, and to build the team round them in the future. This is also where the likes of Steer, Gardner, Baker and Robinson (if he does well and we keep him) have their chance to show what they can do in the Championship. The first three I think could make it into our first team next season, Baker's strength and size (and has been mentioned elsewhere, his balls) make him a good partner for Okore.

What worries me most is the general incompetence shown over the last six or so years. In Lerner's desperation to make the club self supporting (hence the tiny net spend compared to the gross spend once all the money from Benteke and Delph was taken into account) it looks like we'll be selling our biggest assets as we go along. Veretout and Ayew are working their asses off at the moment and the shining lights in the team, they're the two players we need to keep most of all but are they working for the club or looking at it (as Benteke did) as the opportunity to showcase their talent before going to a 'bigger' club? At least Amavi looked like he wanted to be here off the pitch as well as on, which is one of the reasons I think we can keep him. Will Lerner though want to sell him and remove his wages from the bill, bearing in mind Cissokho was signed up when we were on a wage economy drive? Will Ayew and Veretout make themselves worth decent enough money that Lerner will sell them?

Another point, we talk about building a team now that will gel and be ready to hit the Championship running next season but if we do involve Baker, Gardner and Steer, they're not going to be gelling with the team until the summer.

It's imperative we use relegation to build a new team for the next five years, one where we don't sell off our best players and where we don't change manager and playing style every 12 months. We need to build on the academy and spend on really hot prospects as well as develop our own. Is our academy being run properly? Does the training go right from the bottom up? It seems that when we have an injury problem we see someone from the first team played out of position rather than an U21 player coming in. I don't know who plays on the right wing in the U21s but if they're using the same formation as the first team, and playing the same way, then when we do have injuries in the first team like with Traore right now, do we have players ready to step up who know what they're doing and can slot right in? I'd say no, and that if we don't get in someone new soon we're going to see Gil, Sinclair or Westwood there, none of whom are right sided attacking wingers.

I just don't feel confident that our board, manager or owner know how to do this. They have shown repeatedly that they don't know how to run a Premier League club and I think they're about to show they don't know how to run a Championship club either. Sure, Fox (no relation) might say the club is doing well and we're bringing in new sponsorship or whatever, but as fans, unless we see a direct correlation to an improvement in how we (enjoy) watching the Villa, we don't give a flying toss. For us it's not about bottom lines (and we put up with having the names of Chinese gambling companies on our shirts only because we're proud to wear the claret and blue), it's about pride and winning matches.  

I agree mate, we need to get players like Gardner, Baker, Steer and Caulder in the first team so that they can learn to play together. What harm is it going to do to play some U-21 players ? Get us relgated ? That ship has sailed already so we should be planning for the future rather than lamenting the past.

If you want to know how to win the Championship with style you only need to look at what Bournemouth did when they came up. Harry Arter and Callum Wilson tore teams a new one and those are the sort of players we need to be looking at signing. I actually really feel for Bournemouth as i think if they hadn't had a couple of serious injuries early in the season they would be finishing around 10th.

Good post, Foxy!

How the fuck did that useless N'Zogbia get such a long contract? They could have sacked him for gross incompetence on many an occasion. Think of the players who have been with the club as long as he has, 4-5 years. Quite a few have become legends in that time and not picked up anywhere near what that lazy twat has. It will be like getting a new player just getting him off the fucking wage bill.

This is easily how we could end up:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/35253634

achilles wrote:This is easily how we could end up:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/35253634

True. I mean, this could easily be us 

 criticising the turnover of managers, the club's player recruitment and comments made by chief executive Katrien Meire.

Maybe not the turnover of managers but definitely the choice of managers

Supporters were angered when a video emerged of Meire saying it was "weird" fans felt a sense of ownership of the club when "the bills are paid by someone else".

Another board with a complete disconnect from the fans and reality.

Also shows what happens when your interest is in sustainable finances but you employ people who do not have a clue on how to run a football club.

IF we go down, I hope we manage to pack Villa Park every home game. Our home support is so shite and smalltime it's embarrassing.

Didn't we pull 50 k in the third div? That's how it should be.

Getting out of the championship I would say is actually quite easy.

Appoint a manager who achieved such a feat before

Get him more funds than other clubs (doable as we have 20 odd years premiership funding and parachute payments etc)

The problems will start if we start to run\finance  as a championship club - which is precisley what Hollis seems to be saying.

Depending on who goes down we will probably be the one of the wealthiest clubs in the championship. Theres a deloite report out which lists us the 11th richest premier league club - and 23rd richest in the world !!!

Joppe84 wrote:IF we go down, I hope we manage to pack Villa Park every home game. Our home support is so shite and smalltime it's embarrassing.

Didn't we pull 50 k in the third div? That's how it should be.

Really ? - weve won one home game all season and regularly pull in 35,000 - Id say thats pretty remarkable to be honest....

I really don't think we have to worry about getting out of the Championship quickly. Given the incompetent buffoons at the helm of our club I think we can safely assume that our residency in the second tier will be fleeting.

We are destined for the lower reaches IMHO.

Waiting for next seasons fixture list
Leeds away...See you there
Sheff Wed away...See you there
Wolves away...See you there
Noses away...See you there
Walsall away hopefully...See you there.
Saving money like a right scrooge to fly back for these games. That is unless we can pull off a bloody miracle.
See you there then

Noses prob pass us on the way up?? MAKES ME SICK, wish we had there manager, had no money , sold best players still manage to win games

smetro wrote:

Joppe84 wrote:IF we go down, I hope we manage to pack Villa Park every home game. Our home support is so shite and smalltime it's embarrassing.

Didn't we pull 50 k in the third div? That's how it should be.

Really ? - weve won one home game all season and regularly pull in 35,000 - Id say thats pretty remarkable to be honest....

I've followed this club for 30 years now and I honestly think the home following is shockingly bad for a city like Birmingham. It's just always been shite in my life time. When I read about 50 k in third divison in the 70's and 76 k in the 50's or whenever it was, I really can't believe it's the same club. Just where has that football interest gone.  It confuses me no end to be honest. Though ironically I find our support that actually goes pretty fantastic.

Over-exposure on TV will account for a lot of it. But a lot also comes down to a board and senior management that are seemingly doing everything they can to make this club out to be an absolute shit-show.

In other news, I think we'll have the nicest kits in the Championship next season. Under Armor makes quality gear and I really like the kits they created for Spurs recently. I don't know how everyone feels about the Macron stuff, but the last kit I bought ripped a shoulder seam on its first wash, which is unexceptable when you pay the kind of money they charge for a football kit. I don't know how big of a brand UA is over in the UK, but it's one of the largest athletic clothing companies in the USA because they make quality products.

Joppe84 wrote:I've followed this club for 30 years now and I honestly think the home following is shockingly bad for a city like Birmingham. It's just always been shite in my life time. When I read about 50 k in third divison in the 70's and 76 k in the 50's or whenever it was, I really can't believe it's the same club. Just where has that football interest gone. It confuses me no end to be honest. Though ironically I find our support that actually goes pretty fantastic

The cost of watching football was a lot less in those days when it really was a working mans game. In 1974 when I first started watching the team it cost me 10p to stand on the holte

Joppe84 wrote:

smetro wrote:

Joppe84 wrote:IF we go down, I hope we manage to pack Villa Park every home game. Our home support is so shite and smalltime it's embarrassing.

Didn't we pull 50 k in the third div? That's how it should be.

Really ? - weve won one home game all season and regularly pull in 35,000 - Id say thats pretty remarkable to be honest....

I've followed this club for 30 years now and I honestly think the home following is shockingly bad for a city like Birmingham. It's just always been shite in my life time. When I read about 50 k in third divison in the 70's and 76 k in the 50's or whenever it was, I really can't believe it's the same club. Just where has that football interest gone.   It confuses me no end to be honest. Though ironically I find our support that actually goes pretty fantastic.

The strange thing is that, in previous seasons where we have been relegated, our attendances have been much lower against our average at the time.

Joppe84 wrote:

smetro wrote:

Joppe84 wrote:IF we go down, I hope we manage to pack Villa Park every home game. Our home support is so shite and smalltime it's embarrassing.

Didn't we pull 50 k in the third div? That's how it should be.

Really ? - weve won one home game all season and regularly pull in 35,000 - Id say thats pretty remarkable to be honest....

I've followed this club for 30 years now and I honestly think the home following is shockingly bad for a city like Birmingham. It's just always been shite in my life time. When I read about 50 k in third divison in the 70's and 76 k in the 50's or whenever it was, I really can't believe it's the same club. Just where has that football interest gone.   It confuses me no end to be honest. Though ironically I find our support that actually goes pretty fantastic.

For me there are several factors

Firstly we did indeed used to get gates of 70+ thousand back in the heyday of football, even in the 3rd division this club broke records aplenty for attendances with i think 76,000+ against Derby at one point.

Then a few things happened,

TV coverage came in, poverty hit during difficult financial times and also violence erupted on the terraces. By the 70's and 80's attendances had dwindled and also the capacity at Villa Park had been reduced to 48,000 presumably for safety reasons etc.

Then of course the Government had to step in and along came the all seater stadium!

This was the real killer to me because the togetherness and crowd antics which created most of the atmosphere had largely been destroyed by all seater stadiums. I remember the Holte end heaving and all sorts of hilarious things going on & and it was such a laugh, now it's just dull. Even away games are less fun to me in all seater stadiums. I used to be a season ticket holder and go to 80% of away games too but when the all seaters came in it rapidly became a bore if the game was poor and nothing much happening. Sitting has a calming effect which is why the government brought it in of course as there was so much trouble back then. That, along with said crazy prices, have changed the demographic of the average fan, and thus changed the whole match day experience for the worst in my opinion. So passionate fans who used to go for the fun and experience have largely stopped going... i know i have largely as the things i enjoy, the passion, the banter and the joining in with the crowd have largely been stifled out of the game, goodness me i even see stewards throwing people out for getting passionate now! So reluctantly i now only go on occasion to see how the lads are playing, or genuinely to support the club.But the experience is not the same now, If it was i'd be the first in the queue for a ST again believe me.

I remember seeing the VIlla support dwindle after about 1984 to 87 as we were declining fast and ended up relegated of course.. that was a shame as the gates in the early 80's had of course been climbing with loads of sellouts when the capacity was 48,000. I'm sure we would have gotten up to 60k + had the capacity not been reduced during that time certainly in the title winning year

For me the whole character of Villa Park was made by the Holte end, the biggest end terrace in Europe which used to hold 28,000 on it's own! I remember arriving early to a game against West Ham before the ground had opened even and some of the ICF (West Hams firm back then) were gaping in awe as they peered through the turnstiles at the size of the empty Holte end. They were genuinely astounded and asked me "is that the Holte end geezer?" ..I nodded and they went "Jeez we'd heard it was big but F**k me that's massive mate"

All that's gone now and along with it much of the atmosphere.

I wonder if the twats on the board will take huge pay cuts if we are relegated

For me it's going to personally hurt - I won't be getting a season ticket and I won't be able to watch many games on stream #sh*tfan

Sorry to be picky but the 76,000 record attendance was way back in the 30s my grandad was there that day he said you just couldnt move. I think the maximum we had in the third division was 54,000, a friendly against Santos of Brasil (Pele included) and a top of the table clash against Bournmouth, I was there for both matches and again you just couldnt move, it wasnt all seating then either. I was also there the season tommy Docerty came we only had 11,000 there the week before, he came and it went up to 30,000 still went down next season though.

Yeah sorry, I just throw some decades out there.

My point stands though. The football interest in Birmingham is shambolic. In my home town we get 20-35% of the inhabitants on matches. Kinda sad that the football interest in the birth place of professional football is beaten by a tin pot town in Norway.

Obviously is kinda flawed because you got WBA and small heath in there, but even combined Birmingham isn't even remotely close.