This is how much our players want it...

Sunderland's 3rd goal Saturday summed us up perfectly. One cock up after another, eventually leading to Defoe scoring. Forget the cock ups for a minute, forget the fact that as the ball was about to be squared Bacuna had no idea what was happening around him...as that applies to all of our defenders, all of the time.

Just look at this still below.....when it really mattered.....when he still had chance to atone for his and his teams errors, to take one for his team and put his body on the line.....just look at Bacuna as the ball is struck......absolutely pathetic!

That my friends, is our team in a nutshell...not a pair of bollox between them!

Still see people on here and elsewhere rating Bacuna as a player. Laughable!!

Never a truer word, even in parks football you get a rollicking if you turn your back, pathetic.

Yep, dogshit.

Should never turn your back on the ball just put your body on the line.

The players must be following the CEO and owners line. They have turned their back on us for the past 5 years.

I used to cringe watching Matthew Lowton turn away like a girl every time a winger would go to cross the ball. Actually, I shouldn't say that "girl"...I watched some women's league for a few minutes the other day and one of the fullbacks took it right in the knockers!

The game also featured a player I'm sure they said was Hannah Solo. Really! I digress...

I'm so disappointed that Baker never took that next step up as I really thought he could be something. But at least he'd have thrown himself at Defoe - probably would have died in the process - but at least he'd have done everything he could to stop that shot.

Just what the hell is going on in training that encourages fairies like this?

To be fair, I thought Bacuna had his best game for us in some time but that bit of defending just undid everything.

At this level, you cannot afford to switch off. You cannot afford to be less than totally dedicated. You cannot afford to be anything but totally professional. But we are. Every single game. This squad is not bottom 3 material. It's just not. But Villa Park has clearly become a Pontins holiday rather than the highly drilled, highly professional place it should be.

And I'm sure that's down to years of apathy, driven from the owner.

Trotters wrote:I used to cringe watching Matthew Lowton turn away like a girl every time a winger would go to cross the ball. Actually, I shouldn't say that "girl"...I watched some women's league for a few minutes the other day and one of the fullbacks took it right in the knockers!

The game also featured a player I'm sure they said was Hannah Solo. Really! I digress...

I'm so disappointed that Baker never took that next step up as I really thought he could be something. But at least he'd have thrown himself at Defoe - probably would have died in the process - but at least he'd have done everything he could to stop that shot.

Just what the hell is going on in training that encourages fairies like this?

To be fair, I thought Bacuna had his best game for us in some time but that bit of defending just undid everything.

At this level, you cannot afford to switch off. You cannot afford to be less than totally dedicated. You cannot afford to be anything but totally professional. But we are. Every single game. This squad is not bottom 3 material. It's just not. But Villa Park has clearly become a Pontins holiday rather than the highly drilled, highly professional place it should be.

And I'm sure that's down to years of apathy, driven from the owner.

Spot on Trotters....and why I really wanted to post the pic. I though it would have caused more reaction to be honest, as it clearly sums us up!

You're right about Baker, he would of blocked that shot...but then you would expect 90% of professional footballers to block that shot! We don't have players putting their body on the line, just like we don't get enough players busting a lung to get into the box when we're attacking.
When was the last time a villa player got hurt in a 50-50 challenge? When was the last time a villa player got booked or sent off for a bad foul, for lashing out in frustration? These players don't seem to hurt enough...they don't bollock each other, they don't get in the refs face, they don't ruffle the feathers of the opposition...every game is like a bloody training match!!
We need a Joey Barton type on that pitch...like a Lee Cattermole, someone that will get angry and will get the team 'up' on the pitch.

I often wonder what a pre-match and half-time team talk is like at Villa Park. When I played we were scared stiff to go in at half time if we had been shit...can you honestly imagine that being the case now?
I've been in a dressing room with Sam Allardyce (a long time ago may I add)...and trust me...that is not where you wanna be if you haven't put a shift in!
We need to get some fire into the bellies of these players....but how do you do that?

ViewFromT2 wrote:

Trotters wrote:I used to cringe watching Matthew Lowton turn away like a girl every time a winger would go to cross the ball. Actually, I shouldn't say that "girl"...I watched some women's league for a few minutes the other day and one of the fullbacks took it right in the knockers!

The game also featured a player I'm sure they said was Hannah Solo. Really! I digress...

I'm so disappointed that Baker never took that next step up as I really thought he could be something. But at least he'd have thrown himself at Defoe - probably would have died in the process - but at least he'd have done everything he could to stop that shot.

Just what the hell is going on in training that encourages fairies like this?

To be fair, I thought Bacuna had his best game for us in some time but that bit of defending just undid everything.

At this level, you cannot afford to switch off. You cannot afford to be less than totally dedicated. You cannot afford to be anything but totally professional. But we are. Every single game. This squad is not bottom 3 material. It's just not. But Villa Park has clearly become a Pontins holiday rather than the highly drilled, highly professional place it should be.

And I'm sure that's down to years of apathy, driven from the owner.

Spot on Trotters....and why I really wanted to post the pic. I though it would have caused more reaction to be honest, as it clearly sums us up!

You're right about Baker, he would of blocked that shot...but then you would expect 90% of professional footballers to block that shot! We don't have players putting their body on the line, just like we don't get enough players busting a lung to get into the box when we're attacking.
When was the last time a villa player got hurt in a 50-50 challenge? When was the last time a villa player got booked or sent off for a bad foul, for lashing out in frustration? These players don't seem to hurt enough...they don't bollock each other, they don't get in the refs face, they don't ruffle the feathers of the opposition...every game is like a bloody training match!!
We need a Joey Barton type on that pitch...like a Lee Cattermole, someone that will get angry and will get the team 'up' on the pitch.

I often wonder what a pre-match and half-time team talk is like at Villa Park. When I played we were scared stiff to go in at half time if we had been shit...can you honestly imagine that being the case now?
I've been in a dressing room with Sam Allardyce (a long time ago may I add)...and trust me...that is not where you wanna be if you haven't put a shift in!
We need to get some fire into the bellies of these players....but how do you do that?

Very good point about Baker, he really did use to throw himself into challenges. It seems he's doing well on loan at Bristol City too, another player getting regular playing time in the Championship.

Baker lost out for a few reasons at Villa, starting with the disastrous partnership with Clark during one of Vlaar's injury absences (including the 8-0 defeat at Chelsea). Both Baker and Clark has suffered at LB though, mainly because we had completely inadequate full backs, constantly leaving our centre backs exposed, with Vlaar spending half his time covering Lowton or Bacuna rather than concentrating on doing his own job. Lowton scored one superb goal and that's about all we'll remember him for (so did Warnock, come to think of it!) and our LB issues have been ongoing for years, although at least now we have one who can defend in Cissokho. I really hope we can keep hold of Amavi, he looks like the real deal. Just to go through the other players we've had at LB in the last two or three years (that I can remember): Bennett, Baker, Luna, Richardson, Bacuna, N'Zogbia and I think even Lowton had a go there. Three of those are midfielders. I have to say I don't blame Richardson and Bacuna for not being particularly good defenders, they're both midfielders. I'm more inclined to blame managers for playing players out of position. Sinclair or Westwood on the right wing is one that puzzles me, after Traore (and even Gil) proved they could do a better job. Of course that's if you want an attacking player, if you want someone there primarily to defend then at least Sinclair is on his correct left wing when he's running back to defend.

I don't really believe we have a weak squad either, all our managers have had different styles and formations and brought in different players to fill those roles, and then the manager's been sacked in time for the new one to come in with his own square holes to fill. Had Garde come in a year ago to replace Lambert I suspect we'd have had a completely different influx of players, with better answers across the pitch. What I do find incredibly irritating is our managers' inability to adjust their formations and tactics to the players we have. Lambert played the same 4-3-3, defending and trying to convert the few chances we had on the break. Then he changed to possession based football but didn't know what to do once the ball was out of our half, and we got to see lots of sideways passing while our three forwards tried their hardest to both stand still and mark the opposition defenders. Sherwood relied on the full backs providing all our crosses, while changing every other player on the pitch on a regular basis, I really think his rewarding success with being dropped for the next match or two is the reason we're in the stink right now. That and the club's inability to find a proven striker. Someone somewhere made that decision, and I don't mean whoever didn't give Adebayor that sign.

I digress. I maintain our core players for next season in the Championship are Okore, Veretout and Ayew. We all seem agreed that Richards is out of his depth at CB and he needs to be moved or dropped. Okore is a key player for us next season, we need to keep hold of him as best we can, he's the kind of player we need to keep in the long term. Richards at RB for the rest of this season would really make the right side of our defence rock solid. Cissoko at LB is a good defender. In attack he has a laughable lack of right foot, every opposition player facing him has to block the space between him and the touchline and he has to turn in and usually pass backwards. Again, I digress. He's a good defender, and should bring improvements from Clark, Lescott or Baker.

What I think is screwing us is players out of position. We have a huge hole in our defence where Richards is played out of position, destabilising Lescott. It could easily be sorted out by playing our best RB (Richards) at RB, and our best right sided central defender (Okore) in central defence. Cissokho is our best LB option and I suspect we'll see a big improvement from either Lescott or Clark.

Meanwhile with Traore out we need to work out who plays on the right, ahead of Richards and next to Veretout (assuming the manager brings in some players good enough to fill the wings and Gueye's position in a 4-1-4-1 or a 4-2-2, if he's reading the forums!). It isn't Sinclair and Gil is really a number 10. So Bacuna is one option, although not a terribly good one.

I don't know what the answer is to bringing in new players, I tend to concentrate solely on what the Villa are doing and don't pay attention to other leagues. I just hope Garde and anyone else scouting players looks very hard at where the holes are and understands why we need experienced players playing in the correct positions

The problem with Okore is that he is still suffering the after effects of his first injury, therefore he is still not fit enough to play 2 games in 3 days and probably won't start this weekend as he needs to be protected to help him get over these latest problems.
I agree he is one of our brightest lights but he needs time to fully recover and unfortunately in the position we find ourselves he keeps on being rushed back.

FoxyAV wrote:

ViewFromT2 wrote:

Trotters wrote:I used to cringe watching Matthew Lowton turn away like a girl every time a winger would go to cross the ball. Actually, I shouldn't say that "girl"...I watched some women's league for a few minutes the other day and one of the fullbacks took it right in the knockers!

The game also featured a player I'm sure they said was Hannah Solo. Really! I digress...

I'm so disappointed that Baker never took that next step up as I really thought he could be something. But at least he'd have thrown himself at Defoe - probably would have died in the process - but at least he'd have done everything he could to stop that shot.

Just what the hell is going on in training that encourages fairies like this?

To be fair, I thought Bacuna had his best game for us in some time but that bit of defending just undid everything.

At this level, you cannot afford to switch off. You cannot afford to be less than totally dedicated. You cannot afford to be anything but totally professional. But we are. Every single game. This squad is not bottom 3 material. It's just not. But Villa Park has clearly become a Pontins holiday rather than the highly drilled, highly professional place it should be.

And I'm sure that's down to years of apathy, driven from the owner.

Spot on Trotters....and why I really wanted to post the pic. I though it would have caused more reaction to be honest, as it clearly sums us up!

You're right about Baker, he would of blocked that shot...but then you would expect 90% of professional footballers to block that shot! We don't have players putting their body on the line, just like we don't get enough players busting a lung to get into the box when we're attacking.
When was the last time a villa player got hurt in a 50-50 challenge? When was the last time a villa player got booked or sent off for a bad foul, for lashing out in frustration? These players don't seem to hurt enough...they don't bollock each other, they don't get in the refs face, they don't ruffle the feathers of the opposition...every game is like a bloody training match!!
We need a Joey Barton type on that pitch...like a Lee Cattermole, someone that will get angry and will get the team 'up' on the pitch.

I often wonder what a pre-match and half-time team talk is like at Villa Park. When I played we were scared stiff to go in at half time if we had been shit...can you honestly imagine that being the case now?
I've been in a dressing room with Sam Allardyce (a long time ago may I add)...and trust me...that is not where you wanna be if you haven't put a shift in!
We need to get some fire into the bellies of these players....but how do you do that?

Very good point about Baker, he really did use to throw himself into challenges. It seems he's doing well on loan at Bristol City too, another player getting regular playing time in the Championship.

Baker lost out for a few reasons at Villa, starting with the disastrous partnership with Clark during one of Vlaar's injury absences (including the 8-0 defeat at Chelsea). Both Baker and Clark has suffered at LB though, mainly because we had completely inadequate full backs, constantly leaving our centre backs exposed, with Vlaar spending half his time covering Lowton or Bacuna rather than concentrating on doing his own job. Lowton scored one superb goal and that's about all we'll remember him for (so did Warnock, come to think of it!) and our LB issues have been ongoing for years, although at least now we have one who can defend in Cissokho. I really hope we can keep hold of Amavi, he looks like the real deal. Just to go through the other players we've had at LB in the last two or three years (that I can remember): Bennett, Baker, Luna, Richardson, Bacuna, N'Zogbia and I think even Lowton had a go there. Three of those are midfielders. I have to say I don't blame Richardson and Bacuna for not being particularly good defenders, they're both midfielders. I'm more inclined to blame managers for playing players out of position. Sinclair or Westwood on the right wing is one that puzzles me, after Traore (and even Gil) proved they could do a better job. Of course that's if you want an attacking player, if you want someone there primarily to defend then at least Sinclair is on his correct left wing when he's running back to defend.

I don't really believe we have a weak squad either, all our managers have had different styles and formations and brought in different players to fill those roles, and then the manager's been sacked in time for the new one to come in with his own square holes to fill. Had Garde come in a year ago to replace Lambert I suspect we'd have had a completely different influx of players, with better answers across the pitch. What I do find incredibly irritating is our managers' inability to adjust their formations and tactics to the players we have. Lambert played the same 4-3-3, defending and trying to convert the few chances we had on the break. Then he changed to possession based football but didn't know what to do once the ball was out of our half, and we got to see lots of sideways passing while our three forwards tried their hardest to both stand still and mark the opposition defenders. Sherwood relied on the full backs providing all our crosses, while changing every other player on the pitch on a regular basis, I really think his rewarding success with being dropped for the next match or two is the reason we're in the stink right now. That and the club's inability to find a proven striker. Someone somewhere made that decision, and I don't mean whoever didn't give Adebayor that sign.

I digress. I maintain our core players for next season in the Championship are Okore, Veretout and Ayew. We all seem agreed that Richards is out of his depth at CB and he needs to be moved or dropped. Okore is a key player for us next season, we need to keep hold of him as best we can, he's the kind of player we need to keep in the long term. Richards at RB for the rest of this season would really make the right side of our defence rock solid. Cissoko at LB is a good defender. In attack he has a laughable lack of right foot, every opposition player facing him has to block the space between him and the touchline and he has to turn in and usually pass backwards. Again, I digress. He's a good defender, and should bring improvements from Clark, Lescott or Baker.

What I think is screwing us is players out of position. We have a huge hole in our defence where Richards is played out of position, destabilising Lescott. It could easily be sorted out by playing our best RB (Richards) at RB, and our best right sided central defender (Okore) in central defence. Cissokho is our best LB option and I suspect we'll see a big improvement from either Lescott or Clark.

Meanwhile with Traore out we need to work out who plays on the right, ahead of Richards and next to Veretout (assuming the manager brings in some players good enough to fill the wings and Gueye's position in a 4-1-4-1 or a 4-2-2, if he's reading the forums!). It isn't Sinclair and Gil is really a number 10. So Bacuna is one option, although not a terribly good one.

I don't know what the answer is to bringing in new players, I tend to concentrate solely on what the Villa are doing and don't pay attention to other leagues. I just hope Garde and anyone else scouting players looks very hard at where the holes are and understands why we need experienced players playing in the correct positions

Superb post mate...great read and you talk an awful lot of sense.

I wish we could force the villa hierarchy to read some of the stuff posted on here. Alongside the usual fan rhetoric, there really are some superb thoughts and ideas posted!

I 'think' it's a possibility that Richards may have a clause regarding playing centre back...I believe it is the main reason he chose Villa over other teams offering more money. But you are correct. A back four of Cissoko -- Lescott -- Okore -- Richards has a decent look about it (particularly for next season)....I am convinced we need to replace Guzan in this window though. He has become a liability. A 'proper' keeper, and by that I mean a keeper that organises the defence in front of him (yes I know..schoolboy stuff)...would give us an immediate improvement at the back.....do you ever see Guzan out balling at the back four and organising them? No..me neither!

useless s-it been at villa to long... time to get rid

Could you ever envisage someone like this actually giving a shit about OUR club!

Not a chance, but then again, he's one of the one's that hasn't the ability to make much difference anyway, jog on son, jog on.

I’m sorry whats wrong with Bacuna lying down in the sun?

Dgrizzle7 wrote:I’m sorry whats wrong with Bacuna lying down in the sun?

Cos it was during the first half of one of our games....

Dgrizzle7 wrote:I’m sorry whats wrong with Bacuna lying down in the sun?

Quite honestly nothing, in the current climate and situation Villa find themselves, perhaps keeping your head down and not highlighting these things might be better!

It reminds me of a failing organisation which is poorly lead and morale is rock bottom. I experienced this from time when I was a civil servant years ago.

No one really cares about the failure, they just blame it on management and wait for them to be brought to book. No one individual ever tries hard to turn things around. In fact they welcome the impending and inevitable climax.

Only one way to go for Garde if players are not carrying out instructions drop them, even if it's the captain.
The dressing room will not be won back at this stage of the season, players just waiting for the end of season, and some end of contracts.
Just play the ones who are having a go, and play the reserves, and some new players if we can get them.
Hopefully the manager gets some help from upper management, being a villa fan is we are wearing a hair vest all the time, wish our owner had one on, to remind him what he has done to our club.

Thinman wrote:It reminds me of a failing organisation which is poorly lead and morale is rock bottom. I experienced this from time when I was a civil servant years ago.

No one really cares about the failure, they just blame it on management and wait for them to be brought to book. No one individual ever tries hard to turn things around. In fact they welcome the impending and inevitable climax.

+1. Thats exactly whats going on.

achilles wrote:

Dgrizzle7 wrote:I’m sorry whats wrong with Bacuna lying down in the sun?

Quite honestly nothing, in the current climate and situation Villa find themselves, perhaps keeping your head down and not highlighting these things might be better!

Don’t see why a player should be criticized for posting a picture in the sun!!, further more the guy has played rb/lb/dm/cm.

To say players shouldn’t be lying in the sun posting cause were bottom of the league is shocking lool.

This is a tough time but as v2 would say Jezus wept!!

Don't think it was the picture as much as the caption which read along the lines of when things are shit just laugh!