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Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

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Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by Joppe84 on Thu Feb 02, 2017 9:51 am

We've just signed Hogan and there's no way he would sign unless he got to play football. Kodjia won't be dropped, unless Bruce wants him out wide, which would be weird with our options.

How will our midfield look? What's our best setup?

Assuming the pool of players to pick from consists of Bjarnason, Jedinak, Hourihane, Lansbury, Green, Grealish and Adomah. Who will get the slots in a 4 man midfield?

There needs to be some sort of balance in it as well, thus I think Green is a must, but I guess I might be alone there.

What's your preferred line-up?

One alternative is possibly to have Amavi compete for the left winger slot with Green.
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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by Dazzle on Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:06 am

I think Bruce has mentioned wanting to have two up top? We do now have the midfield options to make that workable it's just a matter of how that middle four set up. They could set up as either a flat four or in a diamond, I'm guessing more diamond at Villa Park and perhaps a bit flatter away? But then we have flexibility with formations now, and I'd expect to see what looks like one up top away at Newcastle, for instance, with a more packed looking midfield 5.
Anyway, back to 4-4-2. I'm not sure Bruce is associated so much with wide players, doesn't he tend to want his full backs to carry out those duties? I'm going with a line up at Villa Park as follows;

...............................Johnstone.............................
Bree............Chester...................Baker...........Taylor
...............................Jedinak................................
..............Lansbury....................Hourihane.............
..............................Grealish................................
..................Hogan...................Kodjia...................

I've already tweaked that line up from yesterday, so Mr Bruce is spoiled for options from now on! Over to you Brucey!!
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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by Trotters on Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:15 am

I've said it a few times but I honestly believe one of our biggest issues is the shear size of the pitch. If we play with width, then poor old Jedinackered is gonna have to work hard for his money and I just don't think he's up to covering that kind of real estate.

If we play narrow (like Dazzle's diamond above, which I like more every time I look at it), it exposes the full backs a bit more - although maybe Bree is more capable that Hutton? I know nothing about Taylor.

For sure we can't have a midfield like Bruce played against Brentford: all new, all creative, but not enough of them prepared to really get stuck in when we don't have the ball.

Green has to be getting game time fairly consistently. If he's not starting, then he needs at least 15-20 mins. He'll be a star but he needs that experience.

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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by mefromhere on Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:39 am

Any keeper
Bree Chester Baker Taylor
Adomah Hourihane Lansbury Amavi
Hogan Kodjia
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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by Dions_Bald_Head on Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:41 am

Lansbury will be key for me - he was involved so much when we were doing well for those 15mins or so but then Brentford closed him down & I thought that was strongest link between defence & midfield gone (maybe the head injury didn't help either). The Brentford game was a perfect example of what happens when the midfield are not used to playing with each other - nobody feels confident about where to go off the ball, the cover isn't there or the options, hence the hoofing it up field.

Therefore I'd be tempted to keep it simple: three in the middle can add to the muddle so for the moment I'd play 4-4-2 with Lansbury & Hourihane in the middle with Adomah & Amavi/Green/Thor on the wings.

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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by Dions_Bald_Head on Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:42 am

Pretty much what @mefromhere put while I was typing. Laughing


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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by Nath11 on Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:24 pm

@Dazzle wrote:I think Bruce has mentioned wanting to have two up top? We do now have the midfield options to make that workable it's just a matter of how that middle four set up. They could set up as either a flat four or in a diamond, I'm guessing more diamond at Villa Park and perhaps a bit flatter away? But then we have flexibility with formations now, and I'd expect to see what looks like one up top away at Newcastle, for instance, with a more packed looking midfield 5.
Anyway, back to 4-4-2. I'm not sure Bruce is associated so much with wide players, doesn't he tend to want his full backs to carry out those duties? I'm going with a line up at Villa Park as follows;

...............................Johnstone.............................
Bree............Chester...................Baker...........Taylor
...............................Jedinak................................
..............Lansbury....................Hourihane.............
..............................Grealish................................
..................Hogan...................Kodjia...................

I've already tweaked that line up from yesterday, so Mr Bruce is spoiled for options from now on! Over to you Brucey!!

This is exactly the team i would play. We HAVE to play Jedinak as hes the only defensive CM we have and against Brentford it really did show how much we missed him as there midfield had a field day. I think (hope) with Kodija and Hogan up top making runs, Grealish should start to show his ability we all hope he has by threading balls through and linking up the play!

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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by big ming on Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:23 pm

Definitely need to play Hourihane on his natural left side. Quite what he was doing on the right at Brentford, I have no idea.

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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by deadbuzzardalive on Thu Feb 02, 2017 3:25 pm

Think we'll definitely be playing four four two with wingers, rather than a diamond shape. Hourihane's left-footed but I don't think he plays especially on the right or the left, he moves about within the centre of midfield popping here there and everywhere. Can see him and Lansbury forming a two in the centre, not saying they'll be as good but similar to how Milner and Barry used to played together in a two man midfield.

Whether four four two will work for us I'm not sure, it worked for Leicester when they got promoted. It might see us turn into more of a counter attacking team, which I think might actually suit our players. It would be nice to have an actual style of play.

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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by FoxyAV on Thu Feb 02, 2017 3:48 pm

Are we allowed to play a rush goalie? It might be better than relying on Johnson.
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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by Joppe84 on Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:18 am

@Dazzle wrote:I think Bruce has mentioned wanting to have two up top? We do now have the midfield options to make that workable it's just a matter of how that middle four set up. They could set up as either a flat four or in a diamond, I'm guessing more diamond at Villa Park and perhaps a bit flatter away? But then we have flexibility with formations now, and I'd expect to see what looks like one up top away at Newcastle, for instance, with a more packed looking midfield 5.
Anyway, back to 4-4-2. I'm not sure Bruce is associated so much with wide players, doesn't he tend to want his full backs to carry out those duties? I'm going with a line up at Villa Park as follows;

...............................Johnstone.............................
Bree............Chester...................Baker...........Taylor
...............................Jedinak................................
..............Lansbury....................Hourihane.............
..............................Grealish................................
..................Hogan...................Kodjia...................


That's a good pick, but my problem with it is that we are so bad, we probably need to get back to basics. I think classic 442 with lots of wing play will be easier to get drilled into this utter shit team. I do like your selection though, must admit that.
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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by Dazzle on Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:48 am

@Joppe84 wrote:
@Dazzle wrote:I think Bruce has mentioned wanting to have two up top? We do now have the midfield options to make that workable it's just a matter of how that middle four set up. They could set up as either a flat four or in a diamond, I'm guessing more diamond at Villa Park and perhaps a bit flatter away? But then we have flexibility with formations now, and I'd expect to see what looks like one up top away at Newcastle, for instance, with a more packed looking midfield 5.
Anyway, back to 4-4-2. I'm not sure Bruce is associated so much with wide players, doesn't he tend to want his full backs to carry out those duties? I'm going with a line up at Villa Park as follows;

...............................Johnstone.............................
Bree............Chester...................Baker...........Taylor
...............................Jedinak................................
..............Lansbury....................Hourihane.............
..............................Grealish................................
..................Hogan...................Kodjia...................


That's a good pick, but my problem with it is that we are so bad, we probably need to get back to basics. I think classic 442 with lots of wing play will be easier to get drilled into this utter shit team. I do like your selection though, must admit that.

The way I see it is that from what I've seen both Hogan and Kodjia are forwards that seem comfortable going into the channels to get the ball, therefore offering some of the width that would be lost without natural wingers. We know that both Lansbury and hourihane often pop up in and around the box and get goals, so along with grealish should be able to fill the void left by either Hogan or Kodjia not being there. Jedinak sitting deeper purely tasked with covering. Bree and Taylor are likely to offer a good bit of width also when we earn good possession.
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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by FoxyAV on Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:52 am

@Dazzle wrote:
...............................Johnstone.............................
Bree............Chester...................Baker...........Taylor
...............................Jedinak................................
..............Lansbury....................Hourihane.............
..............................Grealish................................
..................Hogan...................Kodjia...................

That's where Grealish should be playing, not out wide on the wing. I can't really say what Lansbury and Hourihane will be like or how Bruce will play them but one trend this season is for the striker to be isolated from midfield. Grealish is our most creative player and seems to bring a sense of calm - possibly because he comes back to collect the ball from our half before taking it forwards and removes some of the need to punt the ball long for the striker to lose.

Johnson has to stop punting the ball long. I'd say he's even worse than Guzan was. Jed Steer must be really pissed off he's injured, I'd have him in goal over Johnson, Gallini or Bunn. Plus his long kicks were very accurate. I've just looked him up, he's only 24.

Bruce used a 5-3-2 to take Hull up to the PL, I wonder if we now have the midfield and strikers for it but can Bree and Taylor perform as wing backs and would it be too much of a risk to bring in Elphick and leave us with no cover, or bring in Richards on the right with Chester in the middle and Baker on the left?
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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by Joppe84 on Fri Feb 03, 2017 9:41 am

@Dazzle wrote:
@Joppe84 wrote:
@Dazzle wrote:I think Bruce has mentioned wanting to have two up top? We do now have the midfield options to make that workable it's just a matter of how that middle four set up. They could set up as either a flat four or in a diamond, I'm guessing more diamond at Villa Park and perhaps a bit flatter away? But then we have flexibility with formations now, and I'd expect to see what looks like one up top away at Newcastle, for instance, with a more packed looking midfield 5.
Anyway, back to 4-4-2. I'm not sure Bruce is associated so much with wide players, doesn't he tend to want his full backs to carry out those duties? I'm going with a line up at Villa Park as follows;

...............................Johnstone.............................
Bree............Chester...................Baker...........Taylor
...............................Jedinak................................
..............Lansbury....................Hourihane.............
..............................Grealish................................
..................Hogan...................Kodjia...................


That's a good pick, but my problem with it is that we are so bad, we probably need to get back to basics. I think classic 442 with lots of wing play will be easier to get drilled into this utter shit team. I do like your selection though, must admit that.

The way I see it is that from what I've seen both Hogan and Kodjia are forwards that seem comfortable going into the channels to get the ball, therefore offering some of the width that would be lost without natural wingers. We know that both Lansbury and hourihane often pop up in and around the box and get goals, so along with grealish should be able to fill the void left by either Hogan or Kodjia not being there. Jedinak sitting deeper purely tasked with covering. Bree and Taylor are likely to offer a good bit of width also when we earn good possession.

My point remains. Our team is void of "team". We are still a team of individuals and are totally lacking the fundamentals. I think it would be easier to get us going in a straight forward 442, where wing play is a massive relief of pressure we get under. It's essentially what happened when MON took over. He got the basics right by forcing a simple CA style of play.
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Re: Lets assume Bruce wants to play 442

Post by Dions_Bald_Head on Fri Feb 03, 2017 1:48 pm

@Joppe84 wrote:
@Dazzle wrote:I think Bruce has mentioned wanting to have two up top? We do now have the midfield options to make that workable it's just a matter of how that middle four set up. They could set up as either a flat four or in a diamond, I'm guessing more diamond at Villa Park and perhaps a bit flatter away? But then we have flexibility with formations now, and I'd expect to see what looks like one up top away at Newcastle, for instance, with a more packed looking midfield 5.
Anyway, back to 4-4-2. I'm not sure Bruce is associated so much with wide players, doesn't he tend to want his full backs to carry out those duties? I'm going with a line up at Villa Park as follows;

...............................Johnstone.............................
Bree............Chester...................Baker...........Taylor
...............................Jedinak................................
..............Lansbury....................Hourihane.............
..............................Grealish................................
..................Hogan...................Kodjia...................


That's a good pick, but my problem with it is that we are so bad, we probably need to get back to basics. I think classic 442 with lots of wing play will be easier to get drilled into this utter shit team. I do like your selection though, must admit that.

My point too @Joppe84
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