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Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by Fpuppys on Sun Feb 11, 2018 7:21 pm

@deadbuzzardalive wrote:The worship of Hutton is something I can't understand, for most of his time here he's been dreadful, it's only since moving to left-back that he's looked somewhat half decent, but even then he still looks vulnerable defensively, and still wastes a lot of final balls. I saw a thing on twitter the other day that he's taken over thirteen million out of the club in wages, which is staggering, he'll be 34 next season, time to thank him for his efforts, wish him good luck and move on.

Fair price for a player that's been at the club for 7 years, look at all the others before judging one, and that's not me having a dig at you @deadbuzzardalive.
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by villawayne on Sun Feb 11, 2018 7:43 pm

Don't post very often but i wish to add a comment about Alan Hutton. If you watch the game back and on the final whistle Hutton jumps into the arms of John Terry with his arms raised high. This is a player for me who is a total pro, he has taken stick from people but he still shows the heart and passion that players we have employed in recent seasons could only wish upon. Let's hope his arms are raised high at the end of the season. Villa in my Heart

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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by deadbuzzardalive on Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:03 pm

@Fpuppys wrote:
@deadbuzzardalive wrote:The worship of Hutton is something I can't understand, for most of his time here he's been dreadful, it's only since moving to left-back that he's looked somewhat half decent, but even then he still looks vulnerable defensively, and still wastes a lot of final balls. I saw a thing on twitter the other day that he's taken over thirteen million out of the club in wages, which is staggering, he'll be 34 next season, time to thank him for his efforts, wish him good luck and move on.

Fair price for a player that's been at the club for 7 years, look at all the others before judging one, and that's not me having a dig at you @deadbuzzardalive.

Him having been better value for money than Richards and others, doesn't mean to say he's been worth the money he's cost us, far from it, in fact £13m in wages for Hutton plus his initial transfer fee is a diabolical business, for someone who for so long has been the weak link in our team. He's playing alright at the moment, but the club would be making a grave mistake in giving him another contract, after which he'd probably revert back to type, hopefully he continues his improved form, and then let him leave on a high, and he'll get a good deal elsewhere to end his career.

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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by Guest on Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:22 pm

I always said that if the rest of our team in the 2015/2016 season had Hutton's effort and heart, we'd never be relegated.

But unfortunately despite having a good season now in the championship he was largely awful for us where we want to be. I think his positioning was largely at fault, but the amount of times I watched pacy players break past Hutton for for him to recover with a clumsy tackle is in the triple digits.

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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by danclare82 on Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:36 pm

Not long got back to Bolton after going match. Grealish was unreal today. Totally ran the show and they couldn't get near him so tried hacking him down all game. He is different class that kid. Fully deserved MOTM. Hogan worked his ass of too, chased everything and deserved a goal imo. We are so much better than them and it showed todsy. Got lucky with their shot hitting post but totally deserved the win. Up the fucking villa!!
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by deadbuzzardalive on Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:40 pm

It won't happen, and maybe it's a blessing in disguise for us, but I'd take Grealish to the world cup, the way he's playing, there really aren't many English players technically better than him.

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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by Dazzle on Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:53 pm

@deadbuzzardalive wrote:It won't happen, and maybe it's a blessing in disguise for us, but I'd take Grealish to the world cup, the way he's playing, there really aren't many English players technically better than him.

He’d be one hell of an asset in the England squad, he’d be far better protected by referees on the international stage and is the only English player I’ve seen capable of holding the ball and going past players without a reliance on pure pace. If that Winks from Spurs and Livermore can get a cap then the case for Grealish is unarguable. His work rate is now every bit as good as his undoubted natural ability. I’ve said previously that this season Grealish had to prove to everyone what the fuss was about, and he certainly has picked up the baton and is bashing me over the head with it!
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by Guest on Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:58 pm

I don't want him in an England shirt until we are back in the PL. It will just lead to him being sold before we are promoted.

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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by Dions_Bald_Head on Sun Feb 11, 2018 9:58 pm

Great result & a real feeling that things are in that magic zone at the moment - been a while since I thought that, I'd loved to have been there to drink it in.

BBC said that we haven't had this many back-to-back league wins since 1990!?!
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by Saunders82 on Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:08 pm

Down side to all this euphoria is Derby & Cardiff have a game on Tuesday so our stay in second could be short lived, unless we have some more luck like we did when they hit the post today.
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by deadbuzzardalive on Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:42 am

Yes it's annoying that as soon as finally get into the top two, Derby have a game on Tuesday, and Cardiff have two home games coming up, and to top it all off we have to play Fulham next away, pretty much toughest game in the league at the moment.

How we react to the psychological damage of having finally gotten into second place, after trying to get there all season, only for it to be snatched from us mere days later, could define our season, need to stay mentally strong.


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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by Guest on Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:50 am

Anyone have our remaining fixture list at hand?

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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by Dazzle on Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:33 am

@deadbuzzardalive wrote:Yes it's annoying that as soon as finally get into the top two, Derby have a game on Tuesday, and Cardiff have two home games coming up, and to top it all off we have to play Fulham next away, pretty much toughest game in the league at the moment.

How we react to the psychological damage of having finally gotten into second place, after trying to get there all season, only for it to be snatched from us mere days later, could define our season, need to stay mentally strong.


For me it’s clear that the group of players we have are now comfortable with being Aston Villa players and they aren’t going to be knocked out of their stride easily, it’s in their hands now and they don’t have to continually be chasing games. It’s up to the others now to get anxious and have in their minds that Aston Villa are likely to bag 3pts every game, which means they need to win all the time....................so no the pressure isn’t on us, it’s all on the others now chasing us!
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by achilles on Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:47 pm

Another highlight from yesterday was the chant in the second half, started by the Holte but taken up by virtually the whole ground standing up:

'We're going up (raise arms), you're going down (lower arms)'

It was a fantastic spectacle, no certain if it was shown on TV?

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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by achilles on Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:50 pm

Joppe84 wrote:Anyone have our remaining fixture list at hand?

CHAMPIONSHIP Sa 17Feb 2018
Fulham v Aston Villa
CHAMPIONSHIP Tu 20Feb 2018
Aston Villa v Preston
CHAMPIONSHIP Sa 24Feb 2018
Sheff Wed v Aston Villa
CHAMPIONSHIP Sa 03Mar 2018
Aston Villa v QPR
CHAMPIONSHIP Tu 06Mar 2018
Sunderland v Aston Villa
CHAMPIONSHIP Sa 10Mar 2018
Aston Villa v Wolves
CHAMPIONSHIP Sa 17Mar 2018
Bolton v Aston Villa
CHAMPIONSHIP Sa 31Mar 2018
Hull v Aston Villa
CHAMPIONSHIP Tu 03Apr 2018
Aston Villa v Reading
CHAMPIONSHIP Sa 07Apr 2018
Norwich v Aston Villa
CHAMPIONSHIP Tu 10Apr 2018
Aston Villa v Cardiff
CHAMPIONSHIP Sa 14Apr 2018
Aston Villa v Leeds
CHAMPIONSHIP Sa 21Apr 2018
Ipswich v Aston Villa
CHAMPIONSHIP Sa 28Apr 2018
Aston Villa v Derby
CHAMPIONSHIP Su 06May 2018
Millwall v Aston Villa
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by Guest on Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:09 pm

yes floppey you were right again, I just don't know how you've been right so many times this season, floppey next villa manager: Agreed. Can see us losing now. Without Bjarnason we have no energy in that midfield. Awful management

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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by Villa_Dan on Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:41 pm

Grow the fuck up
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by FoxyAV on Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:44 pm

Hutton's future is a funny one. He does work his balls off and does look like he cares, which to a certain extent makes up for his lack of defensive nous and (apart from that cracking cross yesterday) his crossing. He isn't the greatest defender but is better on the left than Taylor, which must be a bit of a worry as I think we overvalued him in the swap for Ayew. Is he better at LB than Amavi? Who knows, I don't think I could call that one and I really liked him and thought he had huge potential. Amavi would have shone at LB in the team as it's set up now. If we do get promoted would Hutton be a complete liability at LB? Yes, I think he would, and I think Elmo will be at RB. Elmo's grown on me but I can't help think he should have gone on loan instead of De Laet. Nothing to be done now but it's a bit of worry to think we may be going into the PL needing new full backs or having to rely on two who aren't really good enough at defending in the Championship.

And yes, from believing we wouldn't be leaving this league while Bruce was still in charge I think the team has finally sorted itself into a strong starting 11 (despite Bruce's best attempts to disrupt it by playing the likes of Whelan and Onomah) capable of actually fighting for automatic promotion. I think had Bruce not being so stubborn keeping Whelan and Onomah in the team we'd not be so far behind Wolves but they haven't started a match since being replaced by Grealish and Thor/Jedi so I can't fault Bruce for learning from his mistakes. And at least he's not changing and disrupting the team every week like Sherwood and RDM.

Going back to yesterday I wonder if Hourihane was being bypassed by the ball being worked more down the wings and Jack running the show in the middle. I only watched the second half on TV so have no idea. Was he really that anonymous and if yes was it just the way the play played out?

I'm off to see Fulham this weekend and can't wait, it's a rare opportunity to dedicate the whole day to beer and football! Think I can make the Cardiff match in April too. That run of five matches in the space of 14 days doesn't look too pretty.

I noticed we had one attacking player on the bench yesterday and an overload of DMs. We're surely going to have to start giving a bit of game time to Davis (and maybe Audrey) from the subs bench just in case Hogan picks up another injury? A goal or two here and there will do wonders for his confidence. I'd rather we stayed with Hogan up front and Grabban on the bench and I suspect Bruce being a creature of habit will do just that. Hogan does have a history of picking up injuries and we're now so close we can't afford to slip up if any players get injured. The team looks nicely balanced now and Hogan is part of that, and Davis showed earlier in the season he's good at working as part of a team (rather than being a Kodjia target man).
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by achilles on Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:01 pm

We had this discussion about Hourihane after the game, as we all thought he had a poor game again (besides his obvious superb goal)! The conclusion we came too was that Hourihane does all his best work in the final third, basically he is an attacking midfield player. The trouble at the moment is that he is not certain where he has to be with Grealish dominating the middle of the park and so he tries to play behind Grealish and sit more which doesn't really suit him. Hopefully he can sort himself out as he is definitely a brilliant option in an attacking sense.

Bruce will definitely go for experience for the rest of the season, which I can see the point as you know exactly what you are going to get. An example was bringing Whelan on at the end, basically he just got in the way of Jedinak as we already had Bjarnason playing in the middle so we ended up with basically three DM players on. I would have preferred to have seen Green on the bench instead of Whelan as we still had Tuanzebe/Onomah as more DM cover but I think Bruce thinks because he bought the players he has to at least have them on the bench, which is ridiculous! However things are going well at the moment so perhaps not introducing U23 players to the group keeps a togetherness within the group, who knows but lets not rock the boat!
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by FoxyAV on Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:21 pm

@achilles wrote:We had this discussion about Hourihane after the game, as we all thought he had a poor game again (besides his obvious superb goal)! The conclusion we came too was that Hourihane does all his best work in the final third, basically he is an attacking midfield player. The trouble at the moment is that he is not certain where he has to be with Grealish dominating the middle of the park and so he tries to play behind Grealish and sit more which doesn't really suit him. Hopefully he can sort himself out as he is definitely a brilliant option in an attacking sense.

Bruce will definitely go for experience for the rest of the season, which I can see the point as you know exactly what you are going to get. An example was bringing Whelan on at the end, basically he just got in the way of Jedinak as we already had Bjarnason playing in the middle so we ended up with basically three DM players on. I would have preferred to have seen Green on the bench instead of Whelan as we still had Tuanzebe/Onomah as more DM cover but I think Bruce thinks because he bought the players he has to at least have them on the bench, which is ridiculous! However things are going well at the moment so perhaps not introducing U23 players to the group keeps a togetherness within the group, who knows but lets not rock the boat!

I said before the last game that Green would be a great option as he can play on the left wing, either covering for an injured (or lacklustre) Adomah or taking that spot so Adomah can cover on the right wing. As it was Onomah came on and I think played on the left wing, which is by far not where he should be. I'm still bemused that Onomah - who has played successfully as DM for England's youth teams - keeps being played anywhere but DM. I'd go so far as to say he should only be on the bench if he trains - and is outstanding - as a DM. O'Hare should be the spare AM, Green the spare winger and Tuanzebe the DM/defensive sub. Add Grabban and Steer and we have an extra slot for Jedi or Whelan (to look angry) and keep Bruce happy.

It's not going to change though, we'll see Whelan, Onomah and Jedi/Thor on the bench for the rest of the season. It took injuries to get us where we are now, it's going to be a remarkable turn of events to see our subs injured, replaced by the players we do need on the bench and those players having the opportunity to shine as subs! The worry though is Adomah being injured at the start of a match and Onomah essentially cancelling out our left wing. In fact I'd go as far as to suggest if that did happen we might be better off shifting to a 4-3-3!

I don't know if I mentioned it before but it would be interesting to see Adomah and Snodgrass swap over every once in a while. It might only be for five or ten minutes but if one is having a hard time of it stick him on the other wing and see if it buggers up the opposition long enough to cause problems.
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by achilles on Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:44 pm

I think the two players we can't afford to lose at the moment are Adomah, followed closely by Grealish!
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by FoxyAV on Mon Feb 12, 2018 4:33 pm

Sure, especially as Onomah seems to be Bruce's idea of the replacement for either!
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by Guest on Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:51 am

Did Grabban do anything when he came on? What was people's impressions?

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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by achilles on Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:11 pm

Joppe84 wrote:Did Grabban do anything when he came on? What was people's impressions?

The only thing I can remember him doing positively was a bit of trickery in the corner to win a corner which was good but he looked a bit lost which is understandably, although he only had ten minutes.
Far to early to arrive at any sort of conclusion as I think he will improve once he gets to know the players more. Probably could play alongside Hogan as well so the options are really good to have.
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

Post by FoxyAV on Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:21 pm

@achilles wrote:
Joppe84 wrote:Did Grabban do anything when he came on? What was people's impressions?

The only thing I can remember him doing positively was a bit of trickery in the corner to win a corner which was good but he looked a bit lost which is understandably, although he only had ten minutes.
Far to early to arrive at any sort of conclusion as I think he will improve once he gets to know the players more. Probably could play alongside Hogan as well so the options are really good to have.

Bearing in mind Bruce has been trying a 4-1-4-1 I wonder if he's considered a 3-5-2 with Tuanzebe at the back? I can see Elmo on right wing and Adomah on left, and it would allow Grabban to play alongside Hogan. I suspect though with both Adomah and Snodgrass scoring and Grealish making himself indispensable in a successful and finally settled team it's going to be a tough call to change anything. As was pointed out earlier about Hourihane looking lost I wonder if the other consideration could be to drop Grealish in favour of Grabban and a 4-4-2.

I think this is where it feels like we're not seeing subs being used in any way other than like for like. By which I mean we could start 4-1-4-1 and if it doesn't work by subbing Grealish (or Thor) for Grabban we could be in a 4-4-2. Who knows, maybe it will come.
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Re: Aston Villa v Birmingham City match thread

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