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The Steve Bruce thread

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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by achilles on Mon Apr 17, 2017 7:51 pm

But Bruce does the same things over and over again and NEVER learns.
Only the other week Bruce admits it was a mistake to play 3 at the back and 2 wingbacks (we have never won this season playing that formation) so what does he do plays that same formation today.

I bet he brings Gabby back for next week... words just fail me!
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by AstonThriller on Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:28 pm

The last three times Bruce has played 532?

Ipswich at home= LOST
Forest away= LOST
Fulham away= LOST

The man simply doesn't learn and still after spending the majority of the season here he doesn't seem to have a clue about the formation/style he wants to play. Why bother wasting any more time? The way he plays simply won't garner enough wins to get us up imo. Because let's be honest, most of his wins have been touch and go. Wigan at home? QPR in both games? Reading away? Derby? etc etc!!..the warning signs are there...but will the board be brave enough to make the call? We'll see.
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by deadbuzzardalive on Mon Apr 17, 2017 9:09 pm

Injuries haven't been that bad, for a spell of games we had quite a few out, but a lot of those were all in the same position. We've always had a decent enough selection of players to choose from. Nothing excuses the football we've been playing under Bruce, it's not so much that it's a retrograde style, it's that there's no style or pattern to the play at all, we're just relying on Kodjia, and there's a good chance that he won't be here next season.

If we stick with Bruce going into next season, I think he'll end up getting the sack after about ten games anyway, as he'll just serve up more of the same, and then once again we'll be playing catch-up.


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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by smetro on Mon Apr 17, 2017 9:47 pm


I can't believe people want to sack a manager with 4 promotions to his name - the last one only 10 months ago, with no obvious replacement in mind.
Sure he has his shortcomings, - He wouldn't be a championship manager if he didn't. I actually think his biggest error is in the goalkeeping department. Worryingly the noises coming out of Villa park is that Johnstone is held in high regard - hope thats wrong
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by deadbuzzardalive on Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:45 pm

Most of those promotions came in a different era of the Championship when the style of play required for promotion was different to what it is now, back then the likes of Warnock, McLeish and McCarthy were getting teams promoted with very old fashioned football. It would probably even be fair to say that the championship's moved on since Hull were promoted, with the arrival of coaches like Wagner, Monk and Staam, and even then they only just about made it through the play-offs, when they should have been doing much better considering on paper they perhaps had the best players in the division.

Put it this way despite his four promotions, I doubt any of our promotion rivals next season will be particularly envious of us having Bruce.

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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by smetro on Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:13 pm

@deadbuzzardalive wrote:Most of those promotions came in a different era of the Championship when the style of play required for promotion was different to what it is now, back then the likes of Warnock, McLeish and McCarthy were getting teams promoted with very old fashioned football. It would probably even be fair to say that the championship's moved on since Hull were promoted, with the arrival of coaches like Wagner, Monk and Staam, and even then they only just about made it through the play-offs, when they should have been doing much better considering on paper they perhaps had the best players in the division.

Put it this way despite his four promotions, I doubt any of our promotion rivals next season will be particularly envious of us having Bruce.

I will be honest I haven't seen a good opposition team at villa park this season. Wolves played us off the park - and reading beat us at a canter but mainly due to our own errors.
I don't think you have to be great to get out of this division, Brighton are one of the better sides assembled over time - Newcastle basically added to the narrowly relegated squad they already had. The teams coming down from the prem this year look in almost as much turmoil as we were.
That said I won't lie, I expected more from Bruce. But I wouldn't be ripping it all up and starting over again in may - I mean who the hell do you get ? Wagner, would he come ? is he that good anyway ?
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by deadbuzzardalive on Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:52 pm

I haven't a clue who we'd get, hopefully Round has a list of names regardless of whether Bruce's job is in immediate danger or not, as you always have to be prepared.

People say that if we bring in another manager then he'll want to bring in his own players, but I actually think if we stick with Bruce we'd need to sign more players to have shot at promotion than we would if we were to bring in Wagner or someone like him. Wagner would get us playing as a team, whereas Bruce needs to litter a team with stars hoping that individual brilliance bails him out, of otherwise uninspiring performances.

In all probability he won't be going anywhere, even if we were to lose the last three, he'll probably still be safe. What I would disappointed with is if we were to let him go, and then replace him with another similar manager like Moyes.

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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by Joppe84 on Tue Apr 18, 2017 8:29 am

@smetro wrote:
I can't believe people want to sack a manager with 4 promotions to his name - the last one only 10 months ago, with no obvious replacement in mind.
Sure he has his shortcomings, - He wouldn't be a championship manager if he didn't. I actually think his biggest error is in the goalkeeping department. Worryingly the noises coming out of Villa park is that Johnstone is held in high regard - hope thats wrong

I think it's largely cause people don't understand that most good stuff in life comes from continuity. Maybe a few here are quite young and thus I can understand it. But if you are 25+ and still haven't figured out that being successful in something requires continuity and the ability to practice, well then you should probably learn a trade at some point.

I don't care if it's football, finance, science and education. I would never have mastered physics and chemistry if I gave up at first hint of adversity. I could never make money in the stock market if I thought what happens this week sets the trend for the next 10 years. Same stuff goes for football. We will lose and win and as we improve and grow as a side we will win more and more. Right now we are one season post relegation and still have a lot of new players. Obviously we still need to tweak the team and Bruce isn't exempted from criticism, but the idea of sacking another manager cause you want instant success is utterly stupid. Stick with him and if we haven't figured this football stuff out by this time next season, then we can consider a managerial change.
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by NARLA24 on Tue Apr 18, 2017 9:22 am

I think we will be fine next season to be honest.
Lots of work to do but i seriously think we will be up there at the top, Bruce or no Bruce.
Yes, it has been a shite season, for those who were expecting to bounce straight back up. That was never going to happen after the complete shite of the last few years, never.
Lets get to work after the players have had a break and look forward to a great season next season. We have to go up next season.
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by AstonThriller on Tue Apr 18, 2017 9:50 am

Reading the other Villa forums and it seems the "Bruce out" calls are really starting to bubble up now. Yes, Bruce has a record of four promotions but then Leicester just sacked a man who just won them the premiership title!!..yesterday's results mean absolutely nothing in the current climate.

Like I said, I think many fans could have been content with Bruce's performance if we could see some green shoots of something happening i.e a style of play that is pleasing to the eye, the odd game where we put a team to the sword etc. But it's just been the same old story over and over. We lump it up to Koj, nick a goal and try to defend, that's it. And many of us can see that that philosophy simply will NOT get us enough wins to get us promoted next season.

So my feeling is this. Why give him the summer to waste a pre-season, more money etc and potentially damage our promotion hopes after ten games next season when we can change things now? The truth is four out of Stam, Jokanovic, Monk, Carvalhal and Wagner are likely to be available come the summer time. Plus Hull go down Marco Silva might be one to look at. So the options will be plentiful if we have the guts to go for it.

Lastly lads do you remember THIS? Could you imagine where we'd be now if our board were forward thinking and appointed him rather than going for "experienced" Mccliesh? I believe we're at a similar juncture right now. We can either stick with the "experienced" dinosaur or create a revolution. For this great club's sake, I hope the board pick the latter. What concerns me though is Wyness seems to be a dinosaur too!!..so will he be brave enough? We'll see.
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by The Utterer on Tue Apr 18, 2017 10:28 am

For the record I actually think that next season it will be very tough to win promotion.

Wolves will be the wealthiest club in the division by some distance and will be strong i feel.

It's looking like Sunderland, Middlesborough and Swansea/Hull for the drop from the Prem, so they will be loaded with £££'s and be expecting to go straight back up too.

Then you have the teams like Leeds, Sheff Weds, Reading, Fulham, Derby etc from this season who will be trying to strengthen again...minus the one who goes up in the playoffs of course.

There is also always but always a team which surprises everyone, it could be Sheff Utd as i think they are pretty decent actually having just won the League 1 title at a canter.

So it will be a LOT tougher than a lot are expecting i fear. Can we do it with SB? .. On the evidence thus far i am not so sure personally. We had a very good 10 game run of results of course and weirdly that coincided with our worst injury crises of the season but i have yet to see us play well and actually look like a "TEAM". Maybe it is just the ridiculous number of changes and we simply need time to properly settle and then the form will come but the jury is most definitely out that's for sure.

As for the sha game at the weekend well i have to say when i saw they had appointed HR my immediate reaction was that it was set up perfectly for him to make an entrance.. Us weakened with our leading, heck almost only scorer banned, having little aside from pride to play for and on the beach... Them with everything to play for and a chance to get off to the best possible start giving him instant hero status should they win!

That game just got a lot tougher put it that way!
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by achilles on Tue Apr 18, 2017 10:53 am

Unfortunately I think that Wyness is old school as well, so I don't think anything will change very soon. Rolling Eyes

I am all for getting rid of Bruce at the end of the season and installing someone with a younger and more dynamic view of how football should now be played. I definitely want to see a higher tempo and a more offensive attitude from our team. And absolutely no more excuses of how tired we are, like yesterday again, we haven't been fit enough for years now, there is absolutely no excuses whatsoever for not being fit enough to play two games in 48 hours!
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by Dazzle on Tue Apr 18, 2017 11:07 am

@Saunders82 wrote:I'm all for giving him the summer to weed out the rubbish still lying around the club, bring in a few key players to strengthen the squad and get a good preseason into everyone. This season we had too many changes not all of them good and we had an absolutely terrible start and were always chasing things from then on, if we get someone new in then it all has to start again, when Ron Saunders ( One of the best managers we have ever had) came to the club things didn't happen overnight same with Taylor, keep the faith. Scarf Waving Scarf Waving Scarf Waving Scarf Waving

It pretty much happened overnight with Taylor, he took over a relegated side and got it promoted first time. He then chased Liverpool to 2nd in the top flight. Things also happened quite quickly under both Atkinson and Little, who had teams winning quickly with quite high numbers of new players. There were also definitive ways those teams played, a distinctive style that was implemented from day 1. I really struggle to see what we're aiming for under Bruce thus far? Surely we should be seeing bits of what's to come by now, something that might enthuse the fans and get them seeing not only a promotion challenge but also ability to compete in the top flight should they get there? What it boils down to at the moment is that if Kodjia were to make noises about wanting a shot at premiership football next season then we are fucked, because the plan seems to start and finish with him. Hogan looks gash, frankly. McCormack isn't a professional. Thus far those two are looking like £20m+ spunked up the wall. We cannot ignore the realities of financial fair play bearing down on us soon, and as things stand I don't see us being one of the favourites next season as we are distinctly bang average. We're certainly far, far behind a fluid and far less expensively assembled Brighton team. Brentford look miles better on viewing evidence. I think we all need to remove the rose tinted spectacles and brace ourselves for a longer stint out of the top flight than we had hoped.
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by AstonThriller on Tue Apr 18, 2017 11:12 am

@The Utterer wrote:

Wolves will be the wealthiest club in the division by some distance and will be strong i feel.
They might be strong next season but the "wealthiest"? I don't think so. One of the Fosun backers is worth 4 billion yes, but let's remember QPR had a man on their board worth more than Abramovic...so it means nothing. They've spent much less than us this season and I expect that to continue. No-one actually knows the real wealth of Xia anyway. Plus Recon are said to be worth billions and we've seen first hand that they know how to spend money. Wolves brought in a bunch of loan players and the only wedge they spent was on Costa which is only to make a profit once they sell him in the summer.



It's looking like Sunderland, Middlesborough and Swansea/Hull for the drop from the Prem, so they will be loaded with £££'s and be expecting to go straight back up too.
But all of them will lose key players and are in just as much turmoil as we were when we came down. I really hope it's Hull who come down because they are rudderless at the moment and Silva won't hang around imo. Meanwhile Sunderland's owner has said he's not gonna be spending big money and wants to sell!!..Boro might be decent but they'd have to rebuild that team I think as they can't score for toffee at the moment.  



Then you have the teams like Leeds, Sheff Weds, Reading, Fulham, Derby etc from this season who will be trying to strengthen again...minus the one who goes up in the playoffs of course.
If you look closely at Leeds, Huddersfield and Fulham you'll find that most of their best players are actually on loan!!..so they don't own many of their better players. This is where we'll have an advantage and personally, I can't see Reading, Huddersfield and Leeds being as strong next season as they've been this year.



There is also always but always a team which surprises everyone, it could be Sheff Utd as i think they are pretty decent actually having just won the League 1 title at a canter.
The danger team for next year may be Brentford I think. They've beaten most of the top teams this year and play very good football. Plus they have a very good structure in place that brings in decent players that fit their philosophy.


Last edited by AstonThriller on Tue Apr 18, 2017 1:49 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by AstonThriller on Tue Apr 18, 2017 11:15 am

@achilles wrote:Unfortunately I think that Wyness is old school as well, so I don't think anything will change very soon.  Rolling Eyes

I am all for getting rid of Bruce at the end of the season and installing someone with a younger and more dynamic view of how football should now be played. I definitely want to see a higher tempo and a more offensive attitude from our team. And absolutely no more excuses of how tired we are, like yesterday again, we haven't been fit enough for years now, there is absolutely no excuses whatsoever for not being fit enough to play two games in 48 hours!

THIS is the man we should move heaven and earth to get as I'm not sure the big clubs will pounce just yet. He's got the record and the philosophy that would transform this club overnight. But the club need to have balls to go in such a direction.
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by Joppe84 on Tue Apr 18, 2017 11:50 am

Doesn't matter. He'll lose a few matches in a row and you would want him sacked as well. Cycle repeats itself. Nailed on.
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by achilles on Tue Apr 18, 2017 12:01 pm

@AstonThriller wrote:
@achilles wrote:Unfortunately I think that Wyness is old school as well, so I don't think anything will change very soon.  Rolling Eyes

I am all for getting rid of Bruce at the end of the season and installing someone with a younger and more dynamic view of how football should now be played. I definitely want to see a higher tempo and a more offensive attitude from our team. And absolutely no more excuses of how tired we are, like yesterday again, we haven't been fit enough for years now, there is absolutely no excuses whatsoever for not being fit enough to play two games in 48 hours!

THIS is the man we should move heaven and earth to get as I'm not sure the big clubs will pounce just yet. He's got the record and the philosophy that would transform this club overnight. But the club need to have balls to go in such a direction.

That would be awesome or someone very similar. Dancing Banana

I am not one of those clamouring for instant success, in fact I am not bothered in the slightest whether we get promoted to the PL as I detest everything it stands for but I fully understand why we have to get promoted as it all comes down to MONEY! I just want to go down to Villa Park and actually be entertained for once and come away saying I have really enjoyed watching that game of football.

So I want a complete change of philosophy, thinking outside the box and revolutionise Villa Park!
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by achilles on Tue Apr 18, 2017 12:05 pm

@Joppe84 wrote:Doesn't matter. He'll lose a few matches in a row and you would want him sacked as well. Cycle repeats itself. Nailed on.

You can tell you don't actually go and watch the games and please don't say you watch it on streams because it is NOT the same!
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by Joppe84 on Tue Apr 18, 2017 12:27 pm

@achilles wrote:
@Joppe84 wrote:Doesn't matter. He'll lose a few matches in a row and you would want him sacked as well. Cycle repeats itself. Nailed on.

You can tell you don't actually go and watch the games and please don't say you watch it on streams because it is NOT the same!

Oh save me that shite. I travel over to watch now and then, and based upon the cost of those travels I probably spend more on Villa than you each season, so please do one.

And FWIW how my comment has any relevance to what you are saying is beyond me. Point remains, if you go to matches or not.
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by Thinman on Tue Apr 18, 2017 1:45 pm

As I get older I am less certain of many many things but I'm absolutely certain that Bruce is never going to lead us back to the PL. The Championship is changing and Bruce's style just isn't going to hack it anymore. It won't happen but given that he'll probably go by Christmas, why not bring in a manager of the new breed at the end of the season and let's start realistic preparations for a promotion challenge.

I wonder how many Bruce defenders there will be left after we lose against Blose on Sunday?
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by AstonThriller on Tue Apr 18, 2017 1:52 pm

@Joppe84 wrote:Doesn't matter. He'll lose a few matches in a row and you would want him sacked as well. Cycle repeats itself. Nailed on.

Nope!!..I would be more than happy to give the man the entire season to get his philosophy imprinted into the club. Bruce wouldn't be getting so much stick if he had a clue about tactics and had a style that at least got the odd fan off their seat!!..but he doesn't and the chickens are coming home to roost imo.
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by Dazzle on Tue Apr 18, 2017 2:33 pm

@Joppe84 wrote:Doesn't matter. He'll lose a few matches in a row and you would want him sacked as well. Cycle repeats itself. Nailed on.

I don't think that's the case for most people here. Everybody loses matches these days, and losing matches isn't the issue in this instance. It's when matches are lost on a relatively regular basis and there are no signs of any improvement in either individual performance or team performance. I'm not seeing anything to date that offers any encouragement looking toward next season, not a single thing. Whether people liked it or not I saw evidence even in Garde of some sort of idea, a style. The fact he got hung out to dry in January shouldn't be overlooked, he simply had the worst owner and set of players to work with in Villa's history, probably.
As someone has mentioned above, the Championship is changing fast. Physical hoofball is quickly being replaced by smarter thinking managers and teams. Its beginning to look like Villa might even get left behind in this league if they aren't careful.
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by deadbuzzardalive on Tue Apr 18, 2017 3:46 pm

Regarding style Xia tweeted this...

Dr. Tony Xia‏Verified account @Dr_TonyXia 5h5 hours ago
Re Qof style: we need get the right environment&system back first, then build winning mentality, stable performance, and football style.


Not sure what he means exactly, but there you go. For me first comes the football style get that right then comes stable performances and a winning mentality, not the other way around.

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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by smetro on Tue Apr 18, 2017 8:40 pm

@AstonThriller wrote:
@achilles wrote:Unfortunately I think that Wyness is old school as well, so I don't think anything will change very soon.  Rolling Eyes

I am all for getting rid of Bruce at the end of the season and installing someone with a younger and more dynamic view of how football should now be played. I definitely want to see a higher tempo and a more offensive attitude from our team. And absolutely no more excuses of how tired we are, like yesterday again, we haven't been fit enough for years now, there is absolutely no excuses whatsoever for not being fit enough to play two games in 48 hours!

THIS is the man we should move heaven and earth to get as I'm not sure the big clubs will pounce just yet. He's got the record and the philosophy that would transform this club overnight. But the club need to have balls to go in such a direction.

Who ?
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Re: The Steve Bruce thread

Post by Saunders82 on Tue Apr 18, 2017 8:58 pm

Some of the comments on here do make me chuckle, I think we all agree that we need stability and a plan but as soon as things don't go as some want the shouts for a change start, if we bring in a new manager you can bet your life he will want his own team and there will be loads of changes AGAIN, then we have to wait for his team to gel. Yes I know we don't look that good at present but lets remember when we got relegated we had the worst bunch of no hopers anywhere, we have brought in loads of new blood to try and correct things but we still have loads of tripe about the place that need moving on, lets grow some balls & see what Brucie does over the summer etc, or are we going to be fickle once again, personally I'm getting fed up of all the pissing about.
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